Jamaat-e-Islami: The Fountainhead Of Religious Extremism

By Yasser Latif Hamdani – Daily Times

Pakistan will have to undo the Maududian infiltration of its state and society. It means liberating our campuses of organisations like the IJT. It means purging the state and its machinery of elements that are furthering the Jamaat’s hate-filled agendaMy article last week on Faisal Shahzad’s radicalisation elicited unprecedented response on the issue of Islamic organisations operating in the US, thereby necessitating this sequel. There are things that need to be said before it is all too late.

Faisal Shahzad’s e-mail to the “peaceful ummah” as published in the New York Times (http://documents.nytimes.com/e-mail-from-faisal-shahzad#text/p1) leaves no doubt about Shahzad’s state of mind. It was his association with Islamic organisations in the West that transformed him into a global jihadist in the classical Qutbian mould. His language, his denunciation of the West and of hypocritical governments in Pakistan, his appeal to “Khilafah” had all the fingerprints of a campus or a local Islamic body, possibly one infiltrated by the Hizb ut-Tahrir and/or global activists of the Jamaat-e-Islami (JI).

All this however should not mean that we should shut ourselves off from the reality of religious extremism in our own neck of the woods. The lashkars and the mujahideen Pakistan’s cynical and wretched establishment prepared against the Soviets, with American blessing, are obviously one part of the overall story. Religious extremism in Pakistan has a sordid history, one of the state’s constant retreat in the face of religious parties — the same religious parties that had opposed the very creation of Pakistan — and horrible compromises with extremist and fascist elements.

To recap, Islamic religious organisations have been part of the political landscape of the subcontinent ever since Indian independence leader Mahatma Gandhi brought them into politics under the guise of the Islamist ‘Khilafat Movement’. It bears repeating that when Gandhi first encouraged Islamic religious clerics for his own anti-imperialist goals, the lone dissenting voice of reason was that of Pakistan’s founding father Jinnah who told Gandhi not to bring “unwholesome elements into public life”. Yet it is Pakistan — ironically — that has come to be associated with the same unwholesome elements today.

After partition, religious extremism in Pakistan reared its ugly head when Majlis-e-Ahrar, a vociferously anti-Pakistan Islamic party during pre-partition days and an erstwhile ally of Gandhi, in 1953 started its campaign of terror against a hapless sectarian minority with the help of another witchdoctor of dubious history, i.e. Maulana Maududi, who till then had become completely irrelevant after his opposition to Jinnah and the Muslim League. To the credit of Pakistan’s judiciary, it swiftly handed down a death sentence for the person who is singlehandedly responsible in providing the ideological foundations for not just the Islamisation in Pakistan but the global Islamic jihad.

Nevertheless the Maulana’s sentence was commuted and it is Pakistan that has suffered as a result. Subsequent to commutation, his book, Islam and Communism, was picked up, reprinted and distributed allegedly by CIA’s JI desk all over the Muslim world. The idea was to use Maududian extremism to stiffen resistance against Soviet expansionism. It is therefore ironic that the JI, Maulana Maududi’s enduring creature, which in 1977 received funds from quarters in the US to overthrow the increasingly pro-Soviet Bhutto, is today the bastion of anti-Americanism. Wonders never cease.

The fountainhead of religious extremism in our country is Mansoora, the headquarters of the JI, in Lahore. Unless Pakistan and the US seriously take a look at the activities of the JI, any meaningful progress in stopping extremism feeding this terror will be impossible. The JI actively works on Pakistan’s largest university campuses to spread its doctrine of hate and bigotry not just against other countries such as the US but religious and sectarian minorities in Pakistan. Its student wing, the Islami Jamiat-i-Talaba (IJT) is modelled after the National Socialist Party. The JI seeks to infiltrate the army, the air force and the civil bureaucracy to weaken the state’s resolve against extremism in Pakistan. Key members of the JI sit in departments such as education introduce nothing but poison in Pakistan’s young minds.

The JI’s mouthpiece, the Daily Ummat, is full of (fifth) columnists who advocate not just extremism but open violence against minorities. Maududi has inspired a generation of Islamists globally. His exegesis of the Holy Quran is widely read and followed by the Salafi Islamic order, predominantly found in the West and the main source of terrorism in the name of religion. Along with Sayyid Qutb of Egypt, Maududi remains the most widely read Islamist ideologue for relatively more affluent Muslims in the west. Within Pakistan too, the target audience is the middle class. It is, therefore, not uncommon to find inter-city bus services advertising during their in-coach entertainment the publications containing “sagacity and wisdom that defeated Communism, Secularism and Capitalism, which flowed from the pen of Sayyid Qutb and Sayyid Maududi” (direct translation). In the triumphalist Islamist narrative, Qutb and Maududi are prophets without parallel.

Pakistan — if it is serious about tackling terrorism — will also have to undo the Maududian infiltration of its state and society. It means liberating our campuses of organisations like the IJT. It means purging the state and its machinery of elements that are furthering the Jamaat’s hate-filled agenda instead of doing their job. The time has come to take stock of the damage this body of conspiratorial and bigoted men has done repeatedly to the body politic of Pakistan.

It must be remembered, for those who still care about the reasons why we made this country in the first place, that Jinnah’s Pakistan and Maududi’s Pakistan are mutually exclusive. Pakistan must decide here and now: do we wish to make Pakistan a prosperous and democratic state, which is at peace home and abroad ala Jinnah? Or do we wish to make Pakistan a violent dystopia run by maniacs and religious extremists with twisted ideas about religion ala Maududi?

The former route shall save us a lot of heartbreak and humiliation. The latter will ultimately lead to our destruction.

Yasser Latif Hamdani is a lawyer based in Islamabad. He can be reached at yasser.hamdani@gmail.com

55 Comments

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55 responses to “Jamaat-e-Islami: The Fountainhead Of Religious Extremism

  1. All times best from YLH…

  2. Peoples who equivocally condemn Zia for all the sins of given rise to religious fanaticism forget the condemnable and deadly role played by the JI militant wings named as “Al Baddar” and “Al Shams” in ex east Pakistan against their political opponents…and in 1953 riots….

  3. yasserlatifhamdani

    Thanks Ali… everyone… no matter what our politics… should come together against the menace of the Jamaat-e-Islami and other such Islamo-fascists …. because only if these terrorists … the Kashifiat types etc … are defeated will Pakistan have any chance of surviving.

  4. Zia Ahmad

    JI, its venomous ideology and slimy goons have been the bane of our national existence. About time they be sent back to their hujras. I fully support Yasser Latif and others in the struggle against JI and its nefarious allies.

  5. PMA

    “Maududi has inspired a generation of Islamists globally…..His exegesis of the Holy Quran is widely read and followed by the Salafi Islamic order, predominantly found in the West……Along with Sayyid Qutb of Egypt, Maududi remains the most widely read Islamist ideologue for relatively more affluent Muslims in the west.”

    Yasser: Moulana Maududi is widely read not only by the Islamists and by the followers of the Salafi Islamic Order, he is also widely read by the Muslims and non-Muslims in general. Most of his readers, even those who do not agree with him or his interpretations of Islamic thought regard him a first rate scholar and an authority on Islam. His books and translations can be found in every major library. As an analyst have you ever wondered why that is so?

  6. kashifiat

    Yeasser !

    A superb piece reflecting your ill mindedness, narrow vision, pathetic understanding, lack of knowledge, pseudo intellectualism, bad observation, bigotry etc etc

  7. yasserlatifhamdani

    Ha ha… spoken like the crook that you are …

  8. yasserlatifhamdani

    PMA,

    I am not an analyst. I am just a simple Pakistani who is sick of crooks – maududi’s illegitimate children- running amok and making a mockery of my country.

    I don’t care if Maududi’s books are carried by every major library. So is Mein Kempf by Adolf Hitler. What is your point?

  9. PMA

    yasserlatifhamdani (May 21, 2010 at 12:44 am):

    Yasser: I do not have a point. Just a question. A genuine one if I may add. As you yourself have pointed it out. Moulana Moudodi is a widely read Islamic scholar all over the world. Politics aside. Have you given a thought why?

  10. yasserlatifhamdani

    Have you given any thought why Adolf Hitler’s “Mein Kempf” is also widely read?

  11. PMA

    yasserlatifhamdani (May 21, 2010 at 1:02 am):

    Yasser: You are sidestepping. I have posed you a question that you need to ponder upon. Take your time if you have to. But unless you find an answer to my sincere question, you will never come to grips over your anxieties regarding Jamaat-e-Islami and its politics.

  12. Zia

    It seems you ‘re using this board to excrete your personal animosity against certain group,nothing constructive in your work. I find it extremely unprofessional from your side though I don’t belong to any political grp.

  13. yasserlatifhamdani

    Mr. Alvi,

    I am not sure how I could put it plainer:

    1. I am not interested in your “sincere” questions.

    2. I am not interested in interacting with you or anyone like you.

    3. I am not interested in finding out why Adolf Hitler’s Mein Kempf is widely read.

    4. I am not interested in overcoming my anxieties about Jamaat’s politics.

    Zia,

    Yes I am. Now you may vote with your feet.

  14. Maudodi and other Qutbian ideologues are given space and fascilitated in the west all over as a counter arguments against communism in the muslim world… As he was the one who oppose land reforms in Pakistan and given rise to a forged interpretation of Islam. To legitimize the re discovered ideology of Pakistan in the late seventies…
    JI were the first who support army action in East Pakistan and even abetted it in the form of militant outfits…
    Haroon Yahya is also a popular Demagogue and socalled Researcher…his magazines are found all over the world and translated in many languages, it does not deny the fact that he’s a hypocrite…
    These bogus ideologues were used and thrown as a toilet paper, Thanks to Zia who transform almost everything as per their wishes…

  15. PMA

    yasserlatifhamdani (May 21, 2010 at 1:22 am):

    My Dear Yasser: I do not mean to irritate you. But if you put out, you have to put up. You been complaining about Jamaat-e-Islami for a long time. But in spite of that its ranks are growing worldwide. You need to go beyond the obvious and ask yourself why. You say you are not interested. Then I guess I can not help you any further.

  16. These bloody hypocrites here behave intolerantly who oppose their ideas and versions and when abroad ask for individual freedom and choice for their practices, they were near to impose sharia in Ontario Canada through hired justice or arbitrary courts, thanks to Muslim Canadian Congress who oppose them…
    For the acts of these people, in the west our people face severe issues and problems..

  17. yasserlatifhamdani

    Mr. Alvi,

    Why do you imagine I need your help? Who the hell are you?

  18. In the fictitious world of dreams someone can imagine modudi’s followers rank is growing higher…
    Yup for the world there is the only version of Islam available which support voilance and terror for their interest, support authoritarianism and monarchs in the muslim world, (there is no such moderate Islam which has its roots in humanism and mutual respect.) and the version before them is modudi Islam….
    JI have imposed what they wish on people through dictatorial regimes or in the present times through islamofascists judges who with every passing day reveal their rant for democratic process, credentials of a secular society as freedom of speech and respect and security for every member of society irrespective of their religious or sectarian affiliations…
    JI version of political Islam will never ever prevail, as there is nothing in it as Islamic…
    As in Pakistan the hypocrites have affixed every bogus and fraudulent BS with the word Islamic, from medicines to banking and political outfits…

  19. As Tibb E islami has nothing to do with Islam, in the same way JI has nothing to do with Islam also…

  20. PMA

    But Ali Arqam (May 21, 2010 at 1:55 am) communism been defeated by the West for two decades now and West has moved on to the new ‘enemies’. The questions we must now ask are that what are the reasons of the popularity of conservative thinkers like Moulana Moudodi and Syed Qutb. Could it be because the Muslim World is ruled by the corrupt elites supported by the West? Could it be that the Political Islam presents an alternative to the rot set in the Muslim Societies? We need to think rationally devoid of emotions. Only then we may find answers to our predicament.

  21. yasserlatifhamdani

    Ali,

    I consider all this nonsense we see these days to be the last hurrah of the flickering candle of Maududism.

    We must blow it out….

  22. yasserlatifhamdani

    Ah… as expected… it is about the “corrupt elites” and class analysis to justify Islamist bigotry.

    This sums up PPP’s valiant struggle against establishment-backed Khawaja Sharifs and such members of “Azad Adlia” on a daily basis.

  23. PMA

    yasserlatifhamdani (May 21, 2010 at 2:25 am):

    Yasser: I am neither an Islamist nor do I justify bigotry, any form of it. I ask a simple question to which I have no answer. What are the reasons behind the appeal of Political Islam both at home and abroad? Why Moulana Moudodi is the single most read Islamic Scholar all over the world? You do not want to indulge in these question, that is fine with me. Don’t get testy. I am not asking you any more. Rest easy my friend.

  24. You are on a wrong assumption Man!! Modudi’s style of Islam is much unpopular in its native countries as of the sub continent…
    If by the presence of his books U are drawing the conclusion that its the popular concept then it might be wrong…
    As people do not differentiata between modudi’s literature with other Qutbian literature as all this is part of one set of ideas as muslim brotherhood, the mother organization of all Islamofascists or terrorist outfits in the name of Islam from Algire to Pak and Sudan etc etc. U obviously have drawn your assumption on the south asian communities and their organizations in the western countries. As par my knowledge moderate people like Hamid Nasr Abu Zaid, A K Sarosh and al Jabbir are more popular in the muslims.
    Its ironic that the dislike shown for their ruling elites is judged by the influence of these ideologues in the western societies as the people suffering from these elites have always rejected there maniacs through the electoral process….

  25. Jamal

    Mawdudi: The Godfather of Islamism and Jihadism
    http://www.newageislam.com/NewAgeIslamRadicalIslamismAndJihad_1.aspx?ArticleID=2816

    Comments are interesting too.

  26. zeenix

    But isn’t this what the forefathers of Pakistan were perpetrating when they decided to draw borders based on religious grounds. The sole raison d’etre of Pakistan was a separate homeland for a religious community. You don’t plead your case on the basis of an ideology and then let it go as soon as your target is achieved. The Objective Resolution was a logical outcome of the pre-partition stance taken by the Muslim League. Once the people were mobilized by the “Pakistan ka matlub kia” slogans, it was only a matter of time when the Mullah brigade would take over.

  27. YLH

    Dear Zenix,

    That may be one view but I don’t subscribe to it and increasingly I think the consensus of historians both in India and in the West is also against this conventional view of partition.

    My reading of history – which you are free to disagree with – is that League’s Pakistan demand was too ambiguous to have had any ideological content … and the champions of Islamic ideology were more or less allied with the Congress.

    Furthermore… transfer of power papers have made it abundantly clear that in the final analysis the partition of Punjab and Bengal along religious lines was affected by the Congress not the League.

    The confusion of what was essentially a worldly product of the fears and apprehensions of the Muslim bourgeoisie (which itself was secular in its approach then) cannot be confused with any real ideological intent.

    The Mullahs were not a necessary step. It may be remembered that the Mullahs – even after Objectives Resolution- did not come to stamp authority in Pakistan till article 2-A was introduced in the constitution by a military dictator.

    The facts of partition have several such nuanced realities that are often overlooked by nationalist mythologies in Pakistan and India primarily because it is beyond the scope of national myth-making to articulate complex ideas which do not place things in the binary of good and evil.

  28. YLH…very balance indeed…

  29. Bhai Ali Arqam & Yasser Hamdani,

    What do you hate more? Maudoodi or Islam?

    You can not bring back USSR, and the taste of defeat of communist at the hands of JI would go with you

    You can not revise “objective resolution”, it’s done with, and with it the fate of the country, as future Islamic state has been sealed.

    You are unfortunate that you were born in a country, that was created on 27th Ramadan, has fought the greatest war of last century on its boarder to defeat communism, has its “mimber o mehraab” totally free to say any thing they want, has nuclear device, do you like it? Which is fighting a jihad in Kashmir and will InshahAllah defeat Indians there, you like it or not?

    Which is bastion of Islam?

    Which has growing number of young men & women practicing Islam as way of life?

    A country that has “islamic lawyer movement”, which files petition against FB and gets verdict in favor!!!!!! How is that?

    You ant seen nothing!!! MR. Ali & Yasser

    You do not know about dedicated JI labor wing, women wing, kisaan wing, our work amongst teachers, our chain of schools

    Oh God, if I only tell you about our schools, you would be roasted, we are the largest NGO to run largest networks of schools in Pakistan, the staggering number is over 3000 !!!!

    3000 schools, 100 kids per school on average, churning 300,000/ stunch muslims every year, oh my God

    You are unfortunate that JI and its 100s of allied partners are growing and not going anywhere

    Pack up and go else where .

    If I were you, I would, why bother and get roasted every moment of life?

  30. YLH

    Mian Javed…

    Thanks for informing me now that I am a communist. Here I was touting capitalist like a wall street wallah!

    You know why we hate you…. it is because while Aliarqam and I may not agree on anything else… both of us know that you religio-fascist terrorists and crooks are going to bring untold destruction to our homeland.

    The March of Humanity is already underway…. precious little you can do to stop it. You can either join it or get trampled under its feet… our only fear is that you don’t bring further disgrace to our homeland …

  31. YLH

    “Which is fighting a jihad in Kashmir and will InshahAllah defeat Indians there, you like it or not?”

    Can you explain why then Crooked Maulana Maududi described the war in Kashmir in 1948 kufr?

    I would like to understand this … or are you Jamaat wallahs all liars and crooks like Maulana Maududi himself?

  32. Bhai Arqam & Hamdani,

    Once upon a time, on the evening of election day in 1971, some one mentioned to Maulana Maududi that Masawat news paper has published head lines that “Maududi THAH, Socialism wah (Down with maududi and hurray to socialism”,

    Upon this Maulana smiled and said that “these people want to say islam Thah,but can not say it, so, they say Mududi thah”.

    Ponder, ask your self, is it relly hatred for him or for Islam?

    Do not tell us , but at least do ask your selves

  33. Dear YLH

    If you use foul language then we should not discuss and debate ,but at least we must not let our inner self come out to the world!!

    If you promise that you would not use words like crook again only then we can continue otherwise its my cup of tea

  34. YLH

    I also want to make it clear… that I consider Maududism to be the antithesis of Islam.

    Any comparison of Maududi with Islam – as members of Jamaat-e-Fitna-e-Maududiat – should itself be sacrilege.

  35. YLH,

    Choar kee dari main tinka, can you quote a piece of my writing which says that you are communist?

    The march of humanity against Islam or against JI?

    By the way where is that march of humanity on display so that I can also see it?

    I think by March of humanity you mean, the exit of US troops from Iraq & Afghanistan

    If that is March of Humanity, then its at the hands of “Mullah” TALIBAN.

    The march of Euro zone soon or the march of capitalism itself soon?

    Please elaborate which march you are talking about

    Show me sign of defeat of Islam and sign of rise of so called “humanity”.

    Show me please

  36. Ok, its clear that you all are Islamic minded guys and you all practice islam and love it and know that you will soon be dead and ill face your maker,

    Your fight is not with Islam, its only with Maududi , is not it?

    And you hate mududi becaue …….

    Can you elaborate please

  37. yasserlatifhamdani

    Javed mian…

    You brought Soviet Union up not I. I am just pointing out that I am a hard core capitalist.

    I think we’ve already explained why we hate the crook.

  38. Bhai Yasser,

    If you are a hard core capitalist, then my dear brother, I dread that there bad news for you around the corner as well, InshahAllah.

    The begining would start with debacle of Euro zone AND THEN THE MARCH OF HUMNITY WILL START

    Being a hard core capitalist, you should be against unnatural and human suppressing system of communism.

    If that is so, then we defeated your enemy, so, you should respect us, like people in east Germany respect Afghans, for their reunification.

  39. zeenix

    @YLH

    Its irrelevant what the leadership of Muslim League wanted as an ideological foundation for Pakistan. The important point that they extensively used the religion card to mobilize the masses towards achievement of a certain objective. Pakistan was created and not liberated. Pakistan simply didn’t exist before 1947. And whether it was intended or not the sole official reason given carving out a new state was safeguarding the interests and cultural values of Muslims.
    Otherwise there was no rationale in carving out a seperate country from within a secular India.

    Once people were mobilized using the religion card, it became the popular slogan. As us Muslims are nostalgic and programmed to revere the past, we somehow connect Islamic Golden age to a theological state, and towards the establishment of a Khilafah, it was easy for the politicans, generals and the like to prey upon that sentiment, and use it to their own advantage. Mullah Establishment alliances were then established which was then perfected by Ameer ul Momineen Zia ul Haq.

    Objective Resolution was a result of that very thought, where going by the popular demand a seemingly secular Prime Minister approved it. That practically paved the way for the religious right to be a real stake holder in determining the ideological direction of the country.
    I don’t agree with Gen Zia being the man behind this Mullah Military Alliance. The pre 71 alliance of JI and Military is no secret as the Al-Badar and Al-Shams fought side by side with the Military. So its penetration within the establishment was way before Zia took over. He can only be blamed for perfecting the art.

  40. YLH

    Well I don’t agree with that view at all. Pakistan is not the first country to be created or the first confessional nation state or a state that went confessional. To mind it is very significant that all champions of Islamic ideology more or less were against the creation of Pakistan.

    so while you have your point of view, I reject it and have written enough about why I reject it.

  41. Zia Ahmad

    Javed saab,
    It seems you find it hard to distinguish between Maududi and his Jamati legacy from Islam. Both are one and the same for you. The idea that Islam is seen and observed differently around the world may baffle you. The Sufi/Salafi divide may not exist for you, the latter being the only thing that exists for you and blindsides you from the complexity of a flesh and blood world.
    The idea that most of the people who do not subscribe to the Salafi/Wahabi/Saudi/(Jamati even) brand of Islam and view it to be restricitve, reductive and limiting may offend you and prompt you to label them heretics and apostates. It might not occur to you that lay as much claim to call themselves Muslims as you do. You dont have the right to decide who’s Muslim or not.
    Now please step back and take a look around you and judge for yourself how a strict diet of Saudi branded Islam, approved by Maududi, has wrecked havoc upon the land of the pure. “Madar Pidar” azadi doesnt bring war to your doorsteps. The engineered slogan Pakistan ka matlab kya…..That surely has. The powers that be tried running the country in the name of Islam but no good has come out of it. Try running it in the name of Pakistan and things just might get better.
    63 years on lets try to bring Pakistan to Jinnah’s original vision, not maududi, zia-ulhaq or the saudi interpretation of it. Mixing state and Islam just isnt working, 63 years is a long time to keep testing the zealot doctrine. Religion, to state the obvious is a personal matter, shoving it down others’ throat doesnt make it any more popular. It’s the nigh second decade of the 21st century and Islam is still confined in medieval times. Ever heard of evolution? It’s much more than a story of apes turning into men.

  42. YLH,

    Islam prohibits fighting with any country or a group, with whom you have your normal relations & agreements or with whom you have signed peace treaty.

    Islam prohibits breach of trust between two countries. So, if you have to wage war against any country with whom you have agreement/relations, then you are first required to warn them clearly and give them notice as per the agreement, besides withdrawing your representatives from that country and closing down your missions.

    We did not do it 1948, and it was too early for war at that stage between two newly born countries as there was no precedence of breach of agreements etc, so, maulana warned out of Islamic spirit that either follow the principles of war and cease relations with India or withdraw troops

    Why is it different now?

    After 1948, India backed out of many promises on Kashmir and even rejected a UN resolution on it.

    India attacked you twice after 1948, unprovoked and what they did with you in Bangladesh tantamount to blatant act of breach of international treaties.

    A lot of waters have flown under the bridge after 1948 between the two countries and why has it become legal to morally support mujahedeen fighting in Kashmir is not some thing you should doubts about being a Pakistani at heart.

    I would like to see your description & details of what you called “MARCH OF HUMANITY is underway”.

    Your detailed description is keenly awaited about it.

    Liars, you called maulana maududi Maulana Maududi a liar, can you quote verifiable instances of liaing by him.

    These items are debit on you ,brother

  43. YLH

    Javed,

    Your latest comment confirms how crooked and dishonest jamaat e islami and followers of that Maulana Maududi are!

  44. YLH

    Emotional out burst and using word “crook” is not the solution.

    What confirmed it?

    Mud slinging suits only street kids, not to mature persons like us, so,please refrain from it and substantiate your such a tall claim, if you do not time and patience or skills to write, then withdraw from this forum, but always substantiate your such tall claims.

    I am waiting for 3 items from your side ,now
    2+1

  45. Jamal

    javed, I don’t know if it answers your question but you may wnat to see what Maududi’s own son says about Maududi;

    Maududi certianly has been a dishonest person all his life.

  46. You raised following points as I could understand, that

    (1)You do not subscribe to maududi’s version of Islam, but you love Islam and you subscribe to some other school of thought in Islam which is not against teaching of prophet (PBUH) and against teachings of Quran. This version is practiced around the world as well.

    (2)People who do not follow Salafi/Saudi/Wahabi Islam are also genuine Muslims and no body has right to call them non Muslims.

    (3)Islam did not auger well for us in last 63 years so let’s try some secular ways of running an estate

    (4) Follower ship of “Strict version of maududi-ism” has brought war on our door steps and has racked havoc on our country.

    (5)Islam is a personal matter nothing to do with state plus Jinnah version was different so let’s adopt that and we may have good results.

    My response
    Point #1

    A. There are 6 school of thoughts in Islam called (a)Shaafi (b) Maliki (c)Hambali (d)Hanafi.(e)Jafri(f)Ghair Muqallid or Ahl e hadees or salafis ,who do not subscribe to any imam.
    B. These schools are there for preserving all practices of Prophet (PBUH) nothing else and there is/should be no frictions between them
    C. We all are mostly Hanafi in Subcontinent, Afghanistan & Egypt.
    D. Amongst Hanafi, there is one basic divide of daiobandis & Brailwees.
    E. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having these 6 groups and 2 sub groups amongst Hanafi, because daiobandis and Brailwees have one FIQAH.
    F. JI does not have any stamp of any one group, there are 99% plus Hanafi in it, either daiobndi or Brailwees from amongst the masses

    Any of the above groups are ok with JI, because they all are true lover of Allah, provided they follow their own true version,

    You would find all kinds in JI, some praying with hand folded down some with hands folded to chest, some doing this act in Names some that, no issues.

    So where does this salfi & Sufi thing comes into play in JI? When there are 99% hanfi in JI. Please elaborate

    Point # 2

    Covered under point #1

    Point # 3
    You think we practiced Islam in our governance that is why we are here today?

    What decisions have we made in last 63 years for the sack of Islam?

    You think Yaha khan, Ayub khan, Bhutto, Zia, Nawaz sheriff, benezir, Pervaiz musharraf or this Gilani is salafi mulism?

    Who listened to Maududi to take his prescribed medicine?

    Who swallowed his pills?

    What were his pills?

    Where is Islam in our decisions during last 22 years? Even the most closest to Islam, out of all heads during these 22 years, Nawaz sheriff, challenged decision of Islamic ideology council to implement non interest based economy.

    Show me Islam there in last 22 years?

    Point # 4

    Did Islam bring war to our door step or Russia?

    Or you mean that ok Russia had ventured in Afghanistan, but we should have forgotten about saving Afghans and we should have saved our own country by not indulging in this war.

    Do you think Russia came for baron Afghan land and Baron Mountains or it came there for “hot waters”?

    No body on earth can be so naïve to think that Russia did not come for our shores of hot waters.

    So, had we not defended Afghanistan, we would have any how capitulated by Russia in our own country,

    This war did not come to us because of religion, it came to us out of sheer “pragmatism” and for “sab say pehlay pakistan”

    When ever Muslim fight, there is Islam in the way they fight, 1965, 1971, syed ahmed shaheed,1856 war all had religious angle to them, were they all perpetrated by Islam?

    Now, let’s talk about this current war at our boarder? Who brought it here?

    USA backed out immediately after 1st afghan war and our own rulers goofed up and did not plan return of all mujahaideen to their native countries

    Iran managed this war far far better then us, by restricting movement of Afghanis to limited/barbed area. We could not manage any thing in this regard, not during the war or after the war resulting in mujahaideen infighting and Kalashnikov culture

    Its ours & USA’s equal bad management not Islam, which brought 2nd afghan war on our door step.

    We should have cleaned the mess immediately after war, instead we mishandled it completely.

    There was no blame to Islam in 1st Afghan war instigation and nor in their after math,

    Who created Taliban? Benezir Bhutto helped it happening by creating TALIBAN

    Point # 5

    In nut shell, people bring in Sufism and sulfism, unnecessarily, to disguise the actual issue.

    Actually, they want Islam out of every thing related to art, culture, education, civilization, judiciary, executive, governance, family matters, principles of business & transaction etc

    They find refuge in sufiism, because Sufism, to them, restricts religion to personal affairs.

    They very innocently lambaste at salfees, who have no role of religion in their way of life, its only “tradition” not religion in saudia.

    While maududi & Syed Qutub cleared the dust over this concept of religion, which was there for centuries and showed million actual concepts for which religion existed.

    It’s a separate debate and if you allow, we can talk about it separately

  47. Midfield Dynamo

    You started off by saying Bhai, but in the end got fiery. This is what JI excels in, the Islamic interpretations or translations are mainstream to begin with (luring in the innocent or the impressionable), but eventually become manipulative essentially for self serving reasons. This is what YLH is talking about, you will have to pay a price for destroying the lives of these innocent/impressionable people for your own selfish ends. Despite your impressive statistics, the numbers on the other side will become overwhelming for you to sustain. Although from this I do not ascertain that your days are numbered, because you have been survivalists and will once again change your demeanor to suit the needs of time.

  48. AZW

    Javed:

    Talk about rambling comment that is all over the place, puts too many words together without coming down to any specifics. Let me explain the “questions” as you tried to answer by writing this long list of your disjointed ideas.

    (1)You do not subscribe to maududi’s version of Islam, but you love Islam and you subscribe to some other school of thought in Islam which is not against teaching of prophet (PBUH) and against teachings of Quran. This version is practiced around the world as well.

    It is a simple matter. That religion has no place in the affairs of the state. It has never worked across the human history when priests have taken charge of the affairs of the state. My love for Islam is for me. I don’t want state to tell me to love my prophet, or to differentiate anyone else if he or she love his or her own prophet. All are equal in the eyes of the state as human beings first and foremost. Everyone is subject to the same laws and has same rights. My love for my religion does not make me superior to anyone else because of their love for a different prophet.

    (2)People who do not follow Salafi/Saudi/Wahabi Islam are also genuine Muslims and no body has right to call them non Muslims

    Of course they are. They are genuine, namkeen, sweet, or asli Muslims for that matter. I don’t care. I just don’t want them to tell me by hiding behind a state that I better be a good Muslim, or state will come up with measures to measure my Islamicness. Practice your faith/sect, anyway you want. I want you to live any way you want, pray five times a day, fast as much as you want, give your full share of zakaat. Just don’t wave a danda and expect everyone to follow the way of life that you have established in your mind. Law is there to protect everyone’s honour, property and freedom; without anyone imposing their brand of religion on anyone else.

    (3)Islam did not auger well for us in last 63 years so let’s try some secular ways of running an estate

    Tell me once in Pakistani history if there was a secular way of running a government. Here is what a secular government entails: Rule of law, protection of life, property, speech regardless of caste and creed. Everyone free to go to mosque, temple, church (remember a famous speech given some 63 years ago on August 11 that has mostly been suppressed in the Pakistani history). And if you think Ayub, Yahya or Bhutto were secular, then sure, keep imagining. Each one of them succumbed to their lust for power, shamelessly used religion to further their rule. Ayub tried his tricks with the election against Miss Jinnah, Yahya used JI to butcher Hindu-ish Bengalis in East Pakistan, and Bhutto shamelessly went on to create Islamic bomb, declare Ahmadis as non Muslims. Secular is not just religionless government. It is government that treats every religion and its followers equally. Too bad as Ahmadis and Shias and Bohras will be exact equal Pakistanis as a regular Salafi or takfiri folk would be in Pakistan. And this equality can only come when law is fair and applied equally. So repeat after me “Secularism is not a godless government. It is a government that allows everyone full rights to pray to their God, without any interference or suppression from anyone

    (4) Follower ship of “Strict version of maududi-ism” has brought war on our door steps and has racked havoc on our country

    Yes it has. Because the concept of Jahilliyaa and Dar-ul-Amn and Dar-ul-Harb is enshrined in the mode of Sharia that these two folks have championed during the past century. There were training camps in Afghanistan if you may remind all of us throughout the 1990s where the Mujahideen were training for what? gardening techniques. And while you keep on thinking about the evil Jews planning the plane hijackings, rest be assured that world will not wait for the thousands of the training camps graduates to have nice cups of tea while they plan attacks across the globe. This is what is called bringing war on the doorsteps.

    Still unsure? Then how about you tell you what Mr. Moudoudi meant by Dar-ul-Amn and Dar-ul-Harb under an Islamic government? And wait a minute, don’t we have an Islamic Emirate presently working in the North Waziristan? What are your thoughts on the Islamic Republic in Waziristan?

    (5)Islam is a personal matter nothing to do with state plus Jinnah version was different so let’s adopt that and we may have good results

    Of course, let’s adopt this. And that means not go running to JIs or JUIs of Pakistan who are always ready to help out the small dictators that champion secularism but in reality were little people in big seats. And how about examining secularism in most of the western nations, and the far East Asia that is working quite well. So well that even JI leaders’ sons and daughters live there as citizens of those countries with exact same rights as the non Muslims like Joneses or Singhs. Why not try a mode of governance that is working quite well.

    And while I am at it, another of your remark about capitalism and debacle of the Eurozone. So let me throw this gauntlet for you; Capitalism will do just fine the way it is working now. Why it confuses and scares the hell out of you is due to its inherent loudness. Where market frictions are not suppressed under some forced ideology, but taken out, critiqued, examined and ratified. It encourages dissention as exchange of ideas mould it into a better efficient system. It doesn’t believe in its rightness otherwise it would never have allowed itself to be incessently questioned.

    Europe is facing its structural problems, but only way it can overcome its problems is to have a crisis reexamine its cogs that are not working well. As bad as it may seem, it is the only way forward. It has been working quite darn well I may say, if standard of living in Europe for the past 70 years are any indication. So keep hoping; and maybe a few decades later if PTH and us are still around, you may drop by and tell us of your newest thoughts, hopes and fears.

  49. Ron

    What a discussion!!

    LOL

  50. Ron

    I heard that Holy Quran is a great book.

    i too believe that.

    Then my friends…..why any need of any other person like Maududi????

    Read the Holy Quran. Understand. Enjoy.

    Why listen to any maududi?

  51. Israr

    JI and Maudoodi are bad

  52. fairmind5

    @ PMAMay 21, 2010 at 2:01 am
    “Yasser: I do not have a point. Just a question. A genuine one if I may add. As you yourself have pointed it out. Moulana Moudodi is a widely read Islamic scholar all over the world. Politics aside. Have you given a thought why?”

    PMA you obviously have NOT read REAL Islamic Scholars. Maududi was NOT a scholar. He was just a WRITER. Thats it! He did NOT know even meaings or Holy Quran words.
    People like you have NOT read REAL islamic scholars because Maududi and people like him have corrupted minds of people like you by branding REAL islamic scholars as Kaffir!
    Please tell me any outstanding Islamic scholar, in Europe, who quotes Maududi to present beautiful, rational, peaceful, tolerant, inspiring, non-sectarian picture of islam???

  53. dharmayoddha

    @ javed.
    Quote”Which is fighting a jihad in Kashmir and will InshahAllah defeat Indians there, you like it or not?

    Which is bastion of Islam? ” Unquote

    What about the hindu minority in kashmir? 10% of the population. What about the 150 odd hindu temples?

    What should I do with the 12% muslim minority in rest of India? what about the mosques.dargah/mazaar etc ? Can You stop me giving “karara jawaab” ? It will happen all over India, definetely in my state Maharashtra.

    Do you even know Maududi’s vision for the muslims in India? “We have no problems if the muslims in India are treated as “mlechhas” (kaffirs) and manu’s laws are applied to them”

    If YLH is giving a liberal vision you oppose him? Would you like me to give a equivalent vision rest of India? would you like India to be a hindu rashtra – a hindu pakistan?

  54. zuhair khan

    La kum Deeno kum wal ya deen…

  55. Kashif Jahangiri

    Maulana Maududi’s way of treating your neighbours…. Reference: Haqiqat-i-Jihad, Pg 64, Taj Company Ltd, Lahore, Pakistan 1964

    QUOTE
    Human relations are so integrated that no state can have complete freedom of action under its principles unless the same principles are not in force in a neighbouring country. Therefore, a, ‘Muslim Party’ will not be content with the establishment of Islam in just one area alone –both for its own safety and for general reform. It should try and expand in all directions. On one hand it will spread its ideology; on the other it will invite people of all nations to accept its creed, for salvation lies only therein. If this Islamic state has power and resources it will fight and destroy non-Islamic governments and establish Islamic states in their place.
    UNQUOTE

    So simple, isn’t it!