The Taliban, the Pakhtun and Imran Khan

Farhat Taj represents a view that is considered quite unpopular in Pakistan. Even if we do not agree with some of the points she frequently raises, the following is an important read to appreciate the complexities of Pakhtun idenity, the Taliban phenomenon,  Taliban sympathizers in Pakistan, and all these factors are currently interacting within the Federation of Pakistan (AZW)

 

By Farhat Taj

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2009\12\19\story_19-12-2009_pg3_2

Hate for the US is the problem of Imran Khan or his anti-Pakhtun allies. It is not the problem of the people of FATA. Their problem is occupation of their land by the international jihadi gangs. There are clear signs that the people of FATA are cooperating with the Americans in liberating their land from the jihadi occupation

This is in response to Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) Chairman Imran Khan’s recent declaration that he is ready to mediate and start negotiations with the Taliban to secure a peace agreement if the government is willing to guarantee that it would not scrap the peace deal with them under US pressure. He made this offer in an interview with Dr Moeed Pirzada on a private TV channel. By now Imran Khan stands fully exposed that he is one of the forces of darkness — the jihadi generals like Hamid Gul, the Jamaat-e-Islami and other pan-Islamists like the Deobandis, neo-Wahabis and Akhwan ideologues. Together they have given the Taliban identity to the Pakhtun and caused massacre of over three million of them on both sides of the Durand Line. They continue to destroy the Pakhtun for a great game against India and in the name of global Islamism. It is, however, the duty of all educated Pakhtuns to challenge the bizarre fabrications that Imran Khan attributed to the people of FATA to justify his offer.

Imran Khan said one of the Taliban groups is made of tribesmen who hate the US and attack the state and society in Pakistan because they see the country in alliance with the US. This is a bizarre fantasy of Imran Khan having nothing to do with tribesmen in FATA. There are no tribesmen who are killing innocent civilians and security forces due to anti-US sentiment. The tribesmen who have joined the Taliban groups are seen as criminals by their fellow tribesmen. The tribesmen who have joined the ranks of different Taliban groups are lost to the global jihadi ideology of the al Qaeda and stand stripped of Pakhtunwali. They are no more Pakhtun! They themselves have given up their Pakhtun identity. They claim to fight for global Islam that disrespects ethnic sensitivities.

The militants, in Imran Khan’s own words in the interview, are 15,000. Clearly not all of them are tribesmen. They include the Punjabi Taliban and foreign terrorists. There are no signs that these 15,000 or so terrorists are backed by tribal society. There has never been any grand tribal jirga in any tribal area that backed the terrorists, local or foreign. The Taliban groups in FATA are Hafiz Gul Abrader Groups, Haqqani Group, Mullah Nazeer Group, Turkistan Brittani Group, Tariq Afridi Group, Mangal Bagh Group, and Maulvi Omar Group. These terrorist groups are killing indiscriminately inside and beyond FATA. None of them had ever been backed by tribal jirgas. In fact, some of them have banned jirgas and termed them as ‘un-Islamic’ institutions. These groups have to be crushed for peace in Pakhtunkhwa and wider Pakistan. Anyone seeking dialogue with such groups is the enemy of the Pakhtun and Pakistan.

Hate for the US is the problem of Imran Khan or his anti-Pakhtun allies. It is not the problem of the people of FATA. Their problem is occupation of their land by the international jihadi gangs. There are clear signs that the people of FATA are cooperating with the Americans in liberating their land from the jihadi occupation. The drone strikes could not have been successful in killing so many al Qaeda and Taliban leaders without the help of the people of Waziristan on the ground.

Moreover, the Taliban kill people every single day in Waziristan on suspicion of spying for the US. They think that with terror they can deter the people of Waziristan from coordinating with the Americans. This has not been successful so far. Why is Imran Khan ever so silent over the daily slaughter of innocent people of Waziristan on charges of spying for the US? Are they not tribesmen and women and even human beings?

The most outrageous statement he made is that the assassinated tribal leadership in Waziristan was pro-US. The leadership has been eliminated by the Taliban with state collusion according to the families of the assassinated people. I challenge Imran Khan to prove that even a single person among the assassinated 600-plus tribal leaders, religious scholars, teachers, doctors, etc., was pro-US! Were respectable tribal elders like Shah Alam Wazir, Khandan Mehsud, Mirza Alam Mehsud, Mohammad Nawaz Mehsud, and Farooq Wazir pro-US? The Taliban beheaded Mufti Sibghatullah and killed Maulana Mohammad Hussain, Imam of Godam Mosque, Tank. Does Imran Khan believe that those religious scholars were also pro-US? Imran Khan must tender an unconditional apology to the people of Waziristan, especially to the family of the assassinated people for making this bizarre statement.

Exploiting the infamous anti-Indian stance, he argues that the government of Pakistan is pleasing India by making the soldiers of the Pakistan Army fight with the Taliban. This is the interpretation of the pro-jihadi forces in Pakistan. It is not the view of the people of FATA. This war is not about India or the US. It is about us — the citizens of Pakistan, whose lives are disrupted by the terrorists who are hell bent upon subjugating us to their version of shariah. The jihadi pursuit of our state created these terrorists and it is now the duty of the state to eliminate them if Pakistan has to survive as a modern democratic state.

Both the PPP and the ANP have lost near and dear ones in terrorist acts of the Taliban. They must continue the fight against the Taliban and ignore the offer of Imran Khan, who is in any case not a neutral party but one of the pro-Taliban forces. In this regard I wish to refer to one of the points of the joint declaration of a grand jirga of all democratic political parties, intelligentsia and civil society organisations held in Peshawar on December 12-13, 2009. The declaration says, “All those political or non-political forces that defend the Taliban and Talibanisation in Pakistan in one way or the other like the Jamaat-e-Islami, Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam, Tehreek-e-Insaf and other outfits are considered anti-Pakistan, anti-people and anti-Pakhtun by the people of Pakhtunkhwa.”

The Pakistan Army must continue fighting the Taliban until their complete elimination. The military establishment must know that lack of protection of the state from the Taliban atrocities has already thrown the people of Waziristan into cooperation with the US in terms of spying for the drone attacks on the terrorists occupying the area. A time may not be far when the rest of Pakhtunkhwa will be cooperating with the US. What would become of the federation of Pakistan in such a situation? Up until now most Pakhtuns are loyal to the federation of Pakistan, but this loyalty is definitely not limitless and requires that the state must protect them and their way of life. By eliminating the Taliban, the army must prove that it stands with the Pakhtun who suffer under the Taliban. In the long run, this may be important for a constant inflow of Pakhtun loyalty with the state of Pakistan.

The writer is a research fellow at the Centre for Interdisciplinary Gender Research, University of Oslo and a member of Aryana Institute for Regional Research and Advocacy

65 Comments

Filed under Afghanistan, Al Qaeda, Army, FATA, Islamabad, North-West Frontier Province, Pakistan, Peshawar, Taliban

65 responses to “The Taliban, the Pakhtun and Imran Khan

  1. YLH

    I don’t think this is an unpopular view though unfairly harsh towards Imran.

    I agree with much of it.

  2. Mustafa Shaban

    I totally disagree with this point of view. I do not completely agree with IK’s view of the campaign against the TTP, but this author is being ridiculous, if he is so confident about his point of view than there should be a public debate between him and IK. I think IK is making a sincere effort to help eliminate the TTP and he has said time and time again that they must be brought to justice and dealt with and also that thier version of Islam is wrong. I cant get where the writeer is coming from.

    IK has also condemned time and again the killing of innocents by the TTP, how does all this make him ” on the dark side” and General Hamid Gul is a patriot.

  3. Bloody Civilian

    @MS

    how does all this make him ” on the dark side” and General Hamid Gul is a patriot.

    i’m afraid i couldn’t understand this part of your sentence. the author has called all of them – gul and IK included – forces of the dark. what are you saying?

  4. Tilsim

    Imran Khan, Mary B, Ali Azmat represent Pakistanis who cannot face the awful reality of the Taliban. Instead, to a great extent their stance betrays their desire to further religious and nationalist jingoism rather than to help Pakistanis to resolutely face this mortal and entirely evil threat. Their stance is causing immense confusion and they know what they are doing.

  5. vajra

    @Bloody Civilian

    You forget: the Student from Dubai writes, he does not read; the Student feels and emotes, he does not think; the Student charges into battle, he does not stop to see who is the foe. Think of him not as a student but as a horse with blinkers on, always at full gallop, and you will gather a picture of him.

    Try to stay out of the way.

  6. Yogesh Shahane

    It is one of the most wonderful feelings to read this blog. I am an indian citizen 27 yrs of age, a hindu brahmin and an IT professional. Ever since 9/11 i started taking interest in indo-pak conflict in a much more wiser manner then earlier. Earlier i was your average jingoist who would hate everything about pakistan. In the last year or so after reading myriads of blogs from pakistan my outlook has changed tremendously and made me lot more humble. I hope and give my best regards to the people of pakistan that they are able to cement democracy and get rid of the thousands of problems that they are currently facing.

  7. Akash

    Imran Khan has gone nuts since Jemima left him. I bet he is missing his days in London where he used to ply his trade as the Loin of Pakistan.

  8. tahir

    Farhat Taj yet again came up with ‘American version of so called war against terror’.If tribes agree with people like Farhat,Musharaf,and Zardari why Pakistan has failed to root out just 5000 Talibans…

    Farhat Taj did not give us any evidence that peopl of FATA are not anti American……

    How could 500o Talibans give tough time to 1000000 tribesmen and 800000 Armymen?

  9. tahir

    Why Pakistanis living in USA are favouring USA over Pakistan and Islam?

    Because they are being fed by USA as it requires self respect and love for country to live a simple life like most of Pakistanis….

  10. mohammad

    IK and other Taliban apologists can not defy the majority of pakistanis, if someone is trying to get deobandi votes, then rest assured there is no political future for him /her, as even if all deobandis in Punjab vote for such people they can not elect a local counsellor let alone an MNA . I am sure all these attention seeking power hungry so called politicians have the backing some unknown forces. I think it is about the time these hidden forces who are pulling the strings of the said clowns are tackled.

  11. sharafs

    A good and better substitute to www. chowk.com

  12. sharafs

    and Varja please do not feel cut why I visit so often.

  13. Bloody Civilian

    Vajra

    it’s when i picture a ‘student’ that i let myself forget. but then the word ‘taliban’ also means ‘students’. in fact, some years ago, a friend of mine working in afghanistan for a charitable organisation tried to tell me how she could work with the taliban govt because they were, at the end of the day, students ie eager to learn. she stood in the way of the galloping horse and was lucky to escape with her life, in the end.

  14. Mustafa Shaban

    @Bloody Civilian: You got me wrong, what I am saying is that the author does not understand IK’s stance. IK is not supporting the TTP, nor is he endorsing thier version of Islam, he also condemns the terrorists attacks done by TTP, his own cousin got killed in the bomb blast in the masjid in Rawalpindi, his idea is that there are some elements that you can have dialogue with and will probably stop fighting while there are elements that you cannot talk to and are extremists, he thinks we can split these 2 elements apart through dialogue, get the tribals on the side of the army and make it a lot easier to defeat the terrorists, with less civilian damage. What I am saying is that in light of the facts , how does this make him a TTP supporter or a supporter of terrorism that the author implies in her article.

    @Tilsim: All of the people you mentioned do not support the TTP, nor do they endorse thier version of Islam, neither do they ignore the Islamic findamentalism in Pakistan. they acknowledge that the Takfiri ideology within Pakistan must be dealt with internally but at the same time we must acknowledge the role of outside forces in flaming the emotions of those who belong to the extreme school of thought against Pakistan Army and Government. They support that TTP should be dealt with and are against the TTP and say that the Army should crush TTP. So can you explain me how they are not facing the terrorists? They understand the internal mistakes of Pakistan and how it creates problems like the TTP but at the ssame time they can see the outside forces taking advantage of these extremists and using them against the state.

    @Vajra: I dont know how you came to that conclusion but if thats what you think its ok. But let me tell you that you have got the wrong picture.

  15. vajra

    @Mustafa Shaban

    Calm down. I like teasing people. Don’t get upset.

  16. vajra

    @sharafs

    What on earth are you talking about? This is your forum, a Pakistani forum. We are the guests. You have been asked for your opinions by thought-leaders, that is credential enough. Further, most of us here are armchair strategists; we will naturally defer to your professional opinion on military matters.

    There are many positions you have taken which I disagree with vehemently. Your military positions will rarely be challenged, your socio-economic stands will be examined threadbare. Be aware that there are no free passes into the second arena.

    I await your choice of weapons.

  17. vajra

    @Bloody Civilian

    He’s younger than H. What would you have me do? However much I feel like kicking his butt from time to time, how can I think of him harshly over an extended period of time?

  18. Bloody Civilian

    @MS

    thanks. that’s clear now.

    if i too could confirm, with your permission, that none of the disagreements are ever personal, and when they seem like that, rest assured they’re not meant seriously.

    @Vajra

    this is one lucky young student we have here🙂

  19. Mustafa Shaban

    @Vajra, Bloody Civilian: I dont take these things personally, I am not upset, its all cool. nothings personal

  20. Ayesha

    @ YLH

    I agree with your views most of the time, but why the soft corner for Imran? Did you watch the show with Moeed that is referenced? I think sometimes PTI supporters (and I am not talking about you here) do not know themselves what their leader stands for. I monitor the statements and opinions of politicians very closely and Imran has repeatedly come on tv to give space to the terrorists. How can he, on the one hand, talk about the 73 constitution, and on the other hand talk about mediating with a group of armed thugs which the 73 constitution squarely forbids. In fact, the Pakistan army is duty bound to put out armed rebellions challenging the writ of the state by the 73 constitution. How can IK talk about rule of law and then sanction jirgas and panchayats that take decisions in direct contravention of the rule of law? He is a confused man—-who, and I agree with the comment above—who is probably taking out his repressed anger at Jemima (who was cheating on him with Hugh Grant but whom he could not say anything to because after all Goldsmith money does fund his children) on the rest of us in Pakistan, especially when it comes to Pakistan’s women and their rights.

    @ Mustafa Shaban,

    The writer of this piece is a woman, not a man. And she would be happy to argue against IK on any show provided our media invites her. Unfortunately, sometimes the quest for ratings overpowers patriotism.

  21. rex minor

    Farhat taj is a controversial number! She is cosidered by some to be linked with the CIA outfit. It is not only the foreigners but locals as well, particularly the journalists to use labels for Pushtoons to cause confusion among the readers. Why does she not follow Hillary Clinton’s statements, the good talabans and the bad talabans. The good talabans are the friends of the west and the bad ones are the enemies. She has no right to attack one of the decent politician Imran Khan, who has taken the courage to have a dialogue or negotiate with the Talabans. Farhat Taj should not worry and write false articles on Pushtoons in support of her Phd studies, which the oslo university will grant her anyway. We should also not ignore the basics;
    . It is completely misleading to keep on calling the tribal land as if the Pakistan Govt. has any legal or physivcal control on this.
    . The Waziri Pushtoons do not negotiate with foreigners. You have to pay them or overpower them. Mr Karzai and Farhat Taj are no different. The US administration is now aware of this unique phenomina and their direct contact with the NWFP and Baluchistan Govts. appear to confirm this reality.
    . Anyone suspected of a contact or negotiations with the foreigners without the knowledge of the respective tribal chief is regarded as a traitor and gets killed by their own family member.
    . It is ridiculously misleading to state that the foreigners Jehadi groups etc.are in control the tribal land.
    . For Pakistan military even the Pushto speaking people are foreigners. I would call Imran Khan a fool but if he is able to do the impossible, others have done before him in the 19th century, then I believe that the Pakistan military should support him to become the next Interior Minister in a national Govt. Afterall, his name doos indicate that his ancestors from the father side were Pushtoons

  22. G.Vishvas

    Pro-islamic history-writing has ruined Pakistan. Dishonesty has become entrenched due to this falsified history-writing and self-glorifying history-narration. I am not saying Pakistan is the only nation that commits this folly. But in this forum we have to write about Pakistan only (and not waste time on other defaulters). Pakistanis must become indepedent thinkers and criticize their ruling ideology which is islam. Islam is causing much backwardness and violence and deceit in Pakistan. Islam is an import from Arabia. It is an alien ideology in the Sindhu river basin. Human beings in the Sindhu river basin deserve their own dignity and freedoms. They should not be quislings of arab imperialism or islamic totalitarianism.

    Many of Pakistan’s problems will be solved or will be brought nearer to a good humane solution if this criticism is taken seriously and not mocked at or vilified. Pakistan will then not be the dangerous country that it is today for its own citizens and to those of others.

  23. nolikegohome

    i would give it a try and i hope it works
    nothing has worked up till now

  24. mohammad

    ‘Either you beat them or buy them’, that seems a cliché, unfortunately that is true reflection of Taliban psyche. There is a misconception of Pak army being punjabi, as pushtoon are fairly represented in armed forces, not to mention Hindku(a dialect of Punjabi) is majority language in 13 districts of NWFP. Let me remind you an incident when IK tried to hold a political meeting in Punjab university, and boy o boy , he was roughened up by Jamati mafia, believe you me I was flabbergasted to see mr IK sitting next to Qazi literally the next day, wow! I am sure Taliban indoctrined so called pseudo Pakhtoon nationalists are tiny minority even in SW . We all knew about ubiquitous presence of deobandi and wahabi terrorists all over tribal areas who were threatening to march over Islamabad, I mean before the commencement of current military operation. Thanks to the co operation of locals PA and FC have upper hand in Swat Kurram Orakzai Darra and Kyber agencies. Waziristan will be calm in near future God willing. Here I will assure everyone that it is not religion but our shortsightedness causing troubles for us.

  25. Mustafa Shaban

    @Ayesha: I disagree with you, IK may have the wrong ideas of how things work but he defenitely isnt a supporter of the TTP. He does not try to justify or endorese anything they do. I did refer to the writer as a woman, not a man. Also you are right about the media, the ratings factor can be a problem but I hope they get her to debate IK.

  26. rex minor

    @Mohammad
    When I was a student I laughed at a speaker who was addressing a small audience in the open Park infront of the college. My father happened to be visiting me and said, do not laugh at the speaker because of few listners, for when the Prophet of Islam started addressing his followers there were not more than one or two!
    Regards to you.

  27. rex minor

    @Mohammad
    The psyche of the entire Pushtoon people is either to defeat(one do not even beat animals now) or pay them, not buy them. They also observe strictly the code of revenge Is it very different from your military? One sorrounds them and they follow the military instructions contained in the text book and surrender. Promise them green dollars and threaten them for non- compliance and they are prepared to accept orders direct from the Foreign Govts. Are you not aware that the former military President handed over bearded foreigners and its own citizens for interrogation to the CIA outfit. There are no Pashtoons or Punjabis in the Pakistan Army, they are straight forward soldiers drilled by suucessive years to take orders without question from the top like your former military President said in the CNN interview. Are the soldiers in the PA are aware that they are to refuse an illegal order? Do your military Generals know that areal bombing and use of heavy artillery against civilians within or ouside the country amount to war crimes. No sir you have inherited the colonial army which was structured to exercise control over the the native Indians. No obvious changes were made over the past half a century and more in the army which has proven their inability to defend the country against foreign armies. I would also never trust a Pushtoon from Karzai to Swat to waziristan, who is not loyal to his family or the tribe. If anyone wants their loyalty for Pakistan, they need to solicit and won the support of the tribe and not individual actors. The Ik offer is bold and worth a try, but he has to learn the Pushto language and be aware that the mission impossible is also very risky.

  28. rex minor

    @Ayesha,
    Are you jealous of IK? He was a big flirt before he got married. Many were following him in the exclusive Ana………..Club. First Bibi Taj attacks him and now you bring out his family(ex wife and children) into discussion. Is it compatible with any of the cultures in your country? Not in the western culture and not in democracies. Even Freedom of speech has some limits and has a red line. Can IK’s ex wife defend against your accusation of an affair…….?

  29. dr jawwad khan

    i am not pakhtoon but i am sympathizer of taliban and agree completely with imran khan….
    regarding farhat taj and alikes…i better keep quite other wise you all have to sit in ice cold bath tub …..

  30. mohammad

    It is high time for tribal lashkars to avenge the brutalities they suffered under Taliban occupation. The whole nation salutes the bravery of tribal Lashkars who are sanitizing their areas of terrorists entities. IK needs to learn arabic than humble pashto, as Taliban engagement is a nascent saudi intelligence initiative.

  31. Ali Abbas

    Rex Minor wrote:”then I believe that the Pakistan military should support him to become the next Interior Minister in a national Govt. Afterall, his name doos indicate that his ancestors from the father side were Pushtoons”

    national Govt. : is that what the security establishment will call the next setup. after their sponsored Judicial coup comes to its logical end.

    Imran Khan and others have been calling for national govts. and all parties conferences everytime they find that the rest of the country not subscribing to their medieval agenda. This is the same Imran Khan whose ideological father is the uber-Taliban, Lt. Gen. r Hamid Gul and who has regularly won one seat in disputed elections and who chose to sit out the last election along with his other ideological bretheren, Jamaat Islami. Apperently, their idea of an All- Parties conference implies that no-seat-in-the-parliament parties like PTI and Jamaat Islami are allowed to derail the action taken against the mass murdering Taliban.

    Ofcourse, Imran Khan is not Pro-Taliban; he simply apologizes for them, deflects criticism from them, distorts their mass murder as some sort of Pushtoon Nationalism and denies their atrocities as sponsored propaganda. In reality, he is in full support of the minorities like Christains, Shias and Ahmadis and has demonstrated that by remaining silent everytime these groups are targetted by Taliban affiliates like the Sipah Sahaba. Just because he says one thing on CNN and another thing on GEO does not mean he is a hypocrate and neither does his denigration of modern science whilst continuing to enjoy its material benefits.

    You see, Imran Khan has never had a chance to defend himself in lenghty, uninterrupted and frequent monologues that he is allowed on nearly all the tv channels of Pakistan. In reality, he is a shy man, unless ofcourse he is seducing British loyalty, which is actually his Jihadi mission.

    Ultimately, those Bhutto-Zardari crooks and their Zionist backers are to blame. Way back when Imran was in Oxford, Benazir and Zardari kidnapped him and stole 10% of his brain and auctioned it in Christies where it sold for 1.5 billion groans which the wily Zardari converted to dollars. This is the reason why Imran Khan has been misunderstood that his defense of the Taliban does not actually make him Pro Taliban!

  32. Milind Kher

    Salutations to the people of Waziristan etc who are putting up a stiff resistance to terrorists like Al Qaeda and Taliban.

    They do not want their culture and philosophy to be ruined by these nihilists. They will definitely win out in the end.

  33. Mustafa Shaban

    @Milind Kher: I am also glad that ordinary people everywhere have rejected this brutal ideology.

    @Ali Abbas: Your ideas about IK are totally wrong and your sarcasm is disgusting, you are just a victim of anti IK propoganda, and you dunt understand what he is saying in his interviews, you propably have only watched a few. Do some research before making any claims, it would really help. If I were to refute all your claims about IK I would probably be typing for about an hour, so my best adivse is just do your research and try to understand what he and other members of PTI are saying, rather than repeat nonsense anti IK propoganda that some people continue repeating which has no base in reality.

  34. Milind Kher

    @Mustafa Shaban,

    What I am essentially familiar with is Imran Khan the cricketer. Can you tell me something about Imran Khan the politician?

  35. Mustafa Shaban

    Milind: Well the politician IK, I can tell you quite a bit about him:

    1. He is sincere

    2. Principled

    3. He is not one who plays vote politics, he says and does what he thinks is right even though some of his ideas are unpopular.

    4. He uses the Khilafat E Rashida as a role model for his policy and manifesto.

    5. He partially uses certain countries as examples for his vision. He mainly sees Singapore, Malaysia and Britain as successful countries and wants to adopt a few of the things they have done.

    6. His ideology is based on Quaid E Azam and Allama Iqbal. His main aim is to create and Islamic welfare state and democracy.

    7. His leadership rolemodels are: Prophet Muhammed SAW , the Khilafat E Rashida, Quaid E Azam, Tun Mahathir Mohammed, and Lee Kun Yu of Singapore. He is alwayz quoting them and taking thier examples in his speeches.

    8. He is different from everybody else. He is not a politicain but reformer, leader and a statesman.

    9. He has used his wealth to benefit this country more than any other politician.

    10. He is also a nationalist who always puts Pakistan first.

    This is my view of IK. People have different views on him. He has become very popular, and his party is rising up fast, in previous elections he got 1%, now things have changed, he has come a really long way since then.

  36. rex minor

    I do not know the guy nor do I know any one of you or your political leaders! Some times pone thinks that he is a nut, and has no judgement, when he considers that britain is successful. Britain is bankrupt and is no longer relying on real economy( industry) but living on income from the stock market transactions. He wuld be more successful if he werte to be involved in sport activities and may be he could even become a sports minister like Pele in Brazil. But this is his own business. He is looking for a break-through in politics so I guess if he wants to arrange a dialogue between the Govt. and the so called Talaban chiefs and prepared to take the risk. why should someone be against it. Do not tell me that you are blood thirsty and agree with those who do not buckle and are willing to see killings of innocent civilians inwaziri land as well as in major cities.
    I pray that reason prevails. I would’nt count on the Alcapone 2 to come to your aid, only dthe disintegration process started in eas Happy holidays.

  37. Milind Kher

    @MS,

    What you have written about Imran Khan seems to be quite positive. However, I do not know whether a majority of people liik at him that way.

    Politically, he has not been able to achieve the same success as he did in cricket.

  38. Mustafa Shaban

    @Milind: Actually that is the impression that some people have, that I say posotive things but he is not popular. This is not true, IK’s popuarity has grown massivly, PTI is probably in the top 4 popular parties of Pakistan, or will be very soon. You need to watc his university speeches, observe the polls, and watch his interviews, all what I have said will come in place.

    @Rex minor: He did not say Britain is successful in that sense, he sometimes talks about some of the democratic structures that work very well in Britain, a small example is that in Britain to participate in any election you have to declare your assets, how much tax you pay, and yyour wealth and an independant election comission investigates your declaration. Things like this. He is not following any particular country, he takes small examples from different countries to make his vision.

    Just because you want to talk to the enemy doesnt mean you endorese thier point of view. IK wants dialouge to take place so that civilian damag decreases and the tribals side with the army against the actual extremists and then wipe them out. How is that endorsing the TTP ideology and its actions? Did the British not talk to the IRA? Are the Americans not talking to the Taliban? Neogtiations and dialogue should play a part in everry conflict.

  39. Mustafa Shaban

    The best way to crush the enemy is t divide and conquer, divide the Pakistani Taliban, separate the negotiable elements from the extreme fanatical elements and then eliminate the most fanatical elements.

  40. Milind Kher

    I really wonder if there are any Taliban elements that are worth negotiating with.

    Given their tribal mindset and their obscurantist beliefs, it is difficult to imagine that they will at all be able to strike a deal or rapport with anybody.

  41. rex minor

    @Mustapha Shaban,
    Sorry I misunderstood. You are perfectly right, people should have a dialogue not negotiations. The Pushtoons do not negotiate but are always willing to have a dialogue to understand each others points of view.
    Ás a guest and an observer on this forum , my concern is also that people under estimate the value of their own culture and over value other Nations due to their education in the foreign environment or colonial background, the anglo saxon politicians have prooven themselves in recent time being the most corrupt in the so called demogratic world. The UK Prime Minister and most members of the Parliment have been claiming unjustified and false expenses from the tax payers. Your mister Zardari is an angel when compared with the american administration and the congressmen, where they term corruption with lobbyist influece!
    Merry Christmas and a happy new year to all.

  42. Mustafa Shaban

    @Milind: Actaully there are elements that are open to negotiations, and have actually called for dialogue, and said they want to talk. When IK proposed dialogue 2 taliban groups called him to tell them they were ready for dialogue.

    According to Army and Government. There are 30 different Taliban groups, all with different motives and objectives. So there are some elements willing to talk, but it cannot be done by Army, it is supposed to be done by gov’t. Thing is they are not doing that.

    @rexminor: You have the right idea but mr. zardari is terrible and bad enough.

    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of you!

  43. Milind Kher

    @MS,

    If there are Taliban elements who are open to negotiation, they have to stand up and come out in the open.

    Today, Pakistan is facing a situation similar to civil war. They need to actively fight the terrorists just like Hurr came over to the side of Imam Hussain (a.s.) to fight the forces of Ibne Saad

  44. Akbarnizam

    must watch this before you comment about innocent taliban “IMRAN KHAN” hidden supporter of taliban. who whatsoever support taliban should be tried for capital punishment.

  45. Milind Kher

    Is it possible that the Taliban has approached Imran Khan because he is from NWFP?

    There may be no harm in at least trying out and seeing what IK does

  46. G.Vishvas

    If anyone or anything (e.g. a book) is regarded as uncriticizable then it leads to a fascism-totalitarianism centered around this person or thing.

    Religion thus becomes a fascism centered around a book or revelation or prophet or land or people.

  47. Ashraf Siddiqui

    Ashraf Siddiqui
    December 29, 2009 at 7:26 am
    If this is what passes for a discourse on important matters affecting our nation then I am glad I am not there to be subjected this diatribe on a daily basis. Most countries have moved on to progress in intellectual as well as practical issues but the new emerging graduates from bigger cities are nothing more than wannabees Indians whose posts reflect amoral, ethicsless and valueless nonesense than realistic analysis of the dire situation Pakistani society is facing. If they are getting their ‘news’ from home media then there is another battle to be fought for real freedom of the media. Would Akbarnizam have us fighting the so-called TTP till both sides have no more people to kill? Is showing might the only answer? Can you go on forever fighting a lost battle? You have learned enough bad English to use Internet but not benefit yourself or others. We have to see that Imran Khan has not been an apologist for anybody but uses political wisdon to search for answers. He challenges corruption, calls for justice and dialogue, as well as being a social worker for health issues in the country – he goes around the world fund-raising for his hospital. Do you know as the Chancellor of the University of Bradford (UK) he has initiated new higher education institutions not for personal ends but for regions of the country that desperately need quality education. Bradford is to build its campus in Pakistan all because of Imran Khan’s efforts – this is modern co-education that the Taliban opposes. Imran’s connections with various international development organisations, educational institutions and individuals of liberal persuation reflects his outlook which is totally opposite of what he is being accused of here. He constantly criticises MQM, Nawaz and PPP’s obsession with family jagirdari i.e Bilawal as the waliahad. Imran brings money into the country and the PML/PPP take money out whilst Altaf goes out himself conducting his party via remote control. Get real you immature biased beings and smell the coffee – even the imperial British had to deal with IRA in Northern Ireland after fighting the for more than 50 years.

  48. Milind Kher

    @Ashraf,

    Would you like to elaborate on how Pakistanis can be wannabe Indians?

    As far as the terrorists are concerned, their nefarious designs stand exposed. By attacking Azadari processions, not only do they want to cause loss of life, but want to generate sectarian strife as well.

    IK will need to be very careful when he wants to negotiate with the TTP, because if he tilts to their side, he stands to lose his entire credibility and respect.

  49. Mustafa Shaban

    Totall agreed with Ashraf.

    @Milind: The TTP will try to create sectarian strife but will not succeed as people are a lot more aware of what they are trying to do. And do not wory bout IK, he is very smart and will be very tactful in his negotiations, the benefit of these talks will be seen once they begin.

  50. Milind Kher

    @MS,

    Let us hope that things work out the way you anticipate. There is nothing to be lost in trying to negotiate, at least if the negotiation is done from a position of strength.

  51. Ayesha

    @ Mustafa Shaban

    If you knew the writer was a woman, why would you refer to her as “he” and “him” in your initial post, and I quote from your post:

    “I totally disagree with this point of view. I do not completely agree with IK’s view of the campaign against the TTP, but this author is being ridiculous, if he is so confident about his point of view than there should be a public debate between him and IK.”

    @ rex minor

    What is there to be jealous of? A dysfunctional lifestyle and a political failure? Imran Khan’s glory days are over—pity rather than jealousy is what I feel for him. FYI, I think a public figure’s personal life is open to comment and debate. Incidentally, that is also what Imran Khan thinks as he regularly talks criticizes personal lives of other politicians. So, if Gilani’s son gets caught in Lahore crossing a red light, I am glad if the papers talk about it; if Tony Blair’s son gets caught with cannabis, I want to know; and similarly, Jemima’s affair with Hugh Grant is not an allegation but a well-established fact—if you do a simple google search, you can read about it—-both have willingly interviewed with the press to talk about it. Jemima and Imran Khan moreover regularly interview with Hello Magazine which discusses relationships, not politics. So if a politician is averse to having his personal life come out in public, he can simply avoid interviewing with Hello, but both Jemima and Imran are quite happy to talk about these things—in fact thrive on it, unlike some other celebrities who choose to keep these things private and avoid social magazines.

  52. Milind Kher

    @Ayesha,

    My belief is that IK is getting more bandwidth in the virtual world than his presence in the everyday world.

    We may possibly be discussing indepth an individual who is actually a political lightweight. On the other hand, someone like Nawaz Sharif does not get discussed at all.

  53. Ayesha

    @ Milind Kher

    Very valid point. I think you are absolutely right. I think Imran realizes he is a political lightweight and thus thrives on controversy simply to get airtime. Nawaz Sharif, on the other hand, is a major political player and one who must be scrutinized more often on sites like Pak Teahouse. He does often cleverly remain on the fence on so many issues, not to mention, also lacks the requisite charisma to be frequently talked about.

  54. rex minor

    @Ayesha,
    I am a bit old fashioned. If you feel pity for him, then this is more dangerous. I thought Jamima is no longer IK’s wife. Hugh Grant might be a bad choice, but Why should’nt she have an affair with someone of her choice? I did’nt get it? Actually I was thinking about his children. In any case if he is offering to have a dialogue with the talibans, why should you be against it? Sorry, no comprendo. By the way I am not from your sub-continent, but have observed that because of his cricket time in the UK, he is usually approached by the media for his views on Pakistan affairs.

  55. rex minor

    @GVishvas
    Nothing personal, but reading your jibberish words about fascism, totali…….., did you by chance spent some days in the US as George W’s guest, or received a special treatment from the torture brigade?

  56. Mustafa Shaban

    @Ayesha:

    I apologize you are right, I mentioned him instead of her.

    IK’s glory days are not overr, PTI and IK are the fastest grwing figures i Paistan in terms of popularity either in national or internet polls. IK is extremely popular and PTI and IK probably will make it to the top3 or 4 in the next elections. I wouldnt be surprised if he got most votes after the most popular NS.

    Anyone who knows IK knows that he is not a man of fame, a slave of polls and vote collecting. He is a sincere man with good principles and honest. His actions prove this. He is not an attention freak but a great man.

  57. Trudi McDonald

    I want to know, does the taliban want to kill everyone, is its goal to take over the planet, and why? does it give you pleasure to slaughter humans in such a cowardly, cunning, immoral way when victims are disarmed, this goes against every religious, human, political doctrine on this earth, who are you? you have to be the reptiles left behind on the last try of conquesting the planet, you will be excinct because you are evil shit and will be flushed down the sewer with the rest of the garbage on this planet. That much I know is true.
    This planet will get rid of you idiots sooner than you think, come in my back yard and I’ll show humanity that you won’t forget, your bombs, you are as weak as shit compared to us, do you have any idea what you are up agansist, you fuck wits, you are dreaming……..The evil shits on this planet
    will not survive because we don’t like you, you don’t fit in, you just wan’t to kill, you have no heart, you are hollow just a skeleton, the only thing you will leave this planet is brutality and murder, gee thats really something to leave for humankind, much the same as what hitler left, gee
    what a reptile he was, and thats what you are.
    The secret is you will never win, do what you have to, and there is no end, the end will be to excinct of you and the world move forward as it should, sorry but you have no control or say in that..

  58. vajra

    @Trudi McDonald

    Why was this eloquent epistle delivered here? This is not a courier service.

  59. Milind Kher

    @Trudi,

    You posted on the wrong board. Were you looking for some extremist group?

    Yet, you may find some people who you can take away..

  60. AZW

    I am not sure what is more prepostrous; the name Trudi McDonald or the garbled comment that Big Mac posted.

    Anyways, Mr. McDonald: Good news is that your comment instantly rocketed to the top spot in terms of absurdity and lack of coherence; and trust me there have been a few serious contenders on this blog for the top spot.

    Bad news is that you are not welcomed to post any more here at PTH. You are most welcome to take your incoherence to your friends, whereever they are on the internet.

  61. Milind Kher

    @AZW,

    Well said. With Aman ki Asha having come up, we are looking for India Pakistan relations to reach a different level altogether.

    Given that, we surely need more and more posts from people who think positively, and not from naysayers and bigots. PTH is a beautiful oasis of Aman🙂

  62. Ayesha

    @ rex minor

    I can tell you are not from our part of the world—your comments reflect how little you know about it. I don’t particularly want to dwell on this but since you ask the question, Jemima’s affair with Hugh started before the divorce—this too is well-documented. I can understand why you don’t comprehend the rest because your knowledge on these subjects is severely limited.

    @ Mustafa Shaban

    Which dreamworld are you living in? PTI and IK are the fastest growing according to what??? If that claim is true, how come they could not win a single seat in the recent Gilgit Baltistan polls? What kind of popularity is this that cannot be proven at the polls? The Musharraf kind, I take it—he too claimed to be very popular but always felt shy of the polls. Even the MQM bagged a couple of seats through aggressive campaigning, coming all the way from the south in Karachi. If IK and PTI claim to be so popular in the north (which I know they are not) then how come such a poor performance in the recent GB polls?

    Also, I don’t know what you mean by “he is is not a man of fame, a slave of polls and vote collecting.” Is he a politician or isn’t he? A politician is judged by how many votes he can get. After being in politics for 12 years, PTI and IK’s performance is absolutely dismal! He was a great cricketer and has done a good job at collecting funds for his cancer hospital. But that does not automatically mean he is a good politician. Abdul Sattar Edhi is a much better politician and it can be very credibly argued that he is far less vain and much less into fame than IK (who incidentally is very much into fame—nobody asks him to pose for Hello, as I said earlier, he does this willingly—there are other men like Hasnat Khan who avoid it)—-but this does not mean that Edhi is fit to run the country either—-though I would rather vote for him than IK.

    BTW, Mustafa Shaban, I saw on Farhat Taj’s recent piece, you were again referring to her as “him” and “he”—-slow learning curve like the PTI leader’s shall I say?

  63. Ayesha

    Correction on the above post:

    I meant Abdul Sattar Edhi is a much better philantropist and mistakenly wrote politician. Sorry about the typo.

  64. rex minor

    @Ayesha
    Sorry it was just my sense of dry humour. I thought Hugh Grant was also caught in the US with a prostitute! But this is another episode of Hugh Grant’s life.
    Regards,

  65. Faizan

    Imran Khan certainly has a softer spot for Taliban than say PPP, MQM,PMLQ or ANP, and perhaps even PMLN. I would place PTI and JI on the same basket on this issue.

    To the PTI followers trying to suggest “but this is not what Imran Khan meant”, consider this point: Imran Khan has spoken about this issue on dozens of tv channels for 100s of hours. It is not a singular statement that you can accuse us of taking out of context or misinterpreting. People are not so stupid that they require you to point out “but this is not what Imran Khan meant” when there is 100s of speeches on this issue by him proving the contrary.