Terrible Tragedy at Fort Hood Texas

By Yasser Latif Hamdani

An Arab American Army Psychiatrist,   Major Nadal Malik Hasan,  opened fire after allegedly shouting Allah hu Akbar.  The immediate consequence,  13 brave Americans who had signed to serve their country are dead on their own base.   It is true that soldiers are put in harm’s way but that decision is not taken by the soldiers themselves.  Soldiers of any country are brave young men and women who have signed up to defend their country.   To be subjected to a cowardly attack by one of their own is therefore tragic.   We at PTH and in Pakistan join the families of those soldiers who died at Fort Hood in mourning those who lost their lives due to this unnecessary and senseless act of cowardice and butchery.

The long term consequences of the actions of Major Hasan will obviously be much bigger especially for the 8-15 million Muslims residing in the United States either as citizens or as residents.    I know of many patriotic young American Muslims serving in the United States Army, Air Force and the Navy.  Their loyalties will become suspect-  after all what would we do if a Christian soldier in the Pakistan Army suddenly opened fire on Pakistani Muslim soldiers?    And it won’t stop there.  Muslims everywhere will be looked at with suspicion. 

As investigation into this terrible act is carried out we will no doubt realize that this tragedy has its roots in an erroneous interpretation of Islam favored by some radical clerics which cannot distinguish, in a strict juristic sense, between a state-ordained just war and mindless and purpose violence by non-state actors.   Therefore now more than ever the US must now engage with the silent majority of the common Muslims as well the Muslim clerics who don’t offer such erroneous interpretations of the faith. 

Muslims in the West must realize that Western systems provide the levellest playing field available for all.   The way to tackle your grievances is to adopt the constitutional and legal means, by using the ballot not the bullet,  by excelling in science and technology, by becoming economically successful and by lobbying your representatives.    And if you are still unsatisfied or disagree with the foreign policy,   leave.  After all no one forced Nadal Hasan to join the US Army. Once he joined it was his moral duty to stand by his fellow officers in the uniform and live by the code that was applicable to him.  If he was so disaffected why didn’t he leave the army first?   Why didn’t he migrate back to his ancestral homeland?  He didn’t because America gave him an education,  a first rate one  at Virginia Tech,  and livelihood.  And America trusted him with the lives of its finest and bravest without any thought about his faith.  

He can claim all the racial and religious discrimination but the truth is that Major Nadal Malik Hasan was a serving soldier of the US Army the day he decided to kill his fellow comrades.   No one fired him despite his fiery declarations that US was wrong and when he told other soldiers that he was happy about US soldiers getting killed.   He must have upset a lot of people, but unlike our Mullahs, no American soldier  laid a finger on him. 

 Today he is being treated alongside those he wounded in  the same hospital where the dead from the shooting were brought in.    And what else-  in the coming days and months he will get the opportunity he didn’t give his fellow soldiers i.e. the opportunity to be heard, the opportunity of due process, the opportunity to tell his side.     He will not be condemned unheard-  perhaps then a sense of shame and remorse will set in and he will realize what a terrible thing he has done to his comrades in arms.

77 Comments

Filed under Islamism, USA

77 responses to “Terrible Tragedy at Fort Hood Texas

  1. Bloody Civilian

    there might well be lawsuits in negligence on the part of the DoD/US Army, as the victims and affectees are entitled to asking the question. and the courts will have to answer that question.

    whether the murderer was clinically insane or the worst excuse for a human being… it would seem the soldiers were owed a relevant duty of care by their employer. the murderer wrote on scribd indicating that he approved of suicide bombing as a strategic weapon. but the more red flags one tries to find, the more one realises how it would have been difficult not to fall into the trap of treating his faith itself as a red flag at some point or level.

    parts of the media and many others have no intention of waiting for the courts’ assessment.

  2. Junaid

    but the more red flags one tries to find, the more one realizes how it would have been difficult not to fall into the trap of treating his faith itself as a red flag at some point or level.

    Just like it difficult not to fall into the trap of treating George Bush’s faith as a red flag.

  3. Anwar

    Very unfortunate….
    Today WSJ devoted an entire page to cover this story and pundits as usual are questioning the rationality of faith…
    Such events are only widening the perceived “gap” and it is even harder on young Muslims as they face more suspicions, questions and capacity to fit into the melting pot….

  4. Bloody Civilian

    @Junaid

    within the relevance of the point being made, that of a US court searching for an answer, some one would have to put your point to the court and convince it that it lies within its jurisdication to consider it. simple.

  5. karun1

    this is increasingly a major problem….i have encountered some of this situations in Mumbai post 26/11 where there were rumours that perhaps some terrorists did gain employment at the Tajmahal Hotel prior to the attack and facilitating the seize and also another well paid IT chap who was involved in hacking/sending messages under the psedonym of Deccan Mujahideen.

    1) One of the friend of my Colleague fired his muslim driver post this incident which was very unfortunate.

    2) I learnt from the Indian CEO of a South Korean privately held company of one of the conditions that their chairman(a south korean) had asked him to follow for recruiting locals : “Do not hire a muslim under any circumstance”!. A south Korean for God’s Sake!!!

    While these examples do highlight the prejudices(or hard practical choices acc. to them), I think even well meaning, secular muslims may well face discrimination and get stifled progressively in this terror stricken world. Perhaps a reform in the muslim world is necessary like never before.

  6. PMA

    “As investigation into this terrible act is carried out………..we will no doubt realize that this tragedy has its roots in an erroneous interpretation of Islam favored by some radical clerics……..which cannot distinguish, in a strict juristic sense, between a state-ordained just war and mindless and purpose violence by non-state actors……….Therefore now more than ever the US must now engage with the silent majority of the common Muslims as well the Muslim clerics who don’t offer such erroneous interpretations of the faith.”

    Tragedy at Fort Hood must not and should not have happened. Lives are prematurely cut short and many more are wounded unnecessarily. What made Major Hassan to commit this insanely act; we do not know for sure right now. Reportedly he is American-born with Palestinian background. Was he upset about the American foreign policy towards Palestine. Was he upset about the Iraq war. What made him to pull the trigger against his fellow Americans and brothers in arm. He is alive and will eventually be put on trial. Much will come out at that time. Until then let us not put his nationality, his ethnicity and his religion on trial. And certainly let us not get into our habitual blame game: “Mullah did it.”

  7. rexminor

    @hamdani
    you are off track in your commentry. why do you want to discuss this tragic incident so soon.no one knows what the details are and mr obama specifically requested restraints in making judgment?you are very quick in your drum beat about islam;
    major hassan is
    1)an american born citizen
    2) is part of the military machinery and holds an officer rank of a major
    3) is a qualified psychiatrist and has been looking after the soldiers’ health returning from the active duty in iraq and afghanistan.
    (everyone knows how killing of old, women and children civilians do to a soldier when he is asked to partiticipate in it. -the rate of suicides in us military has been growing.)
    4)he is of a palistinian arab origan.
    5)he is practicing a muslim religion.
    6)he was under orders to move to afghanistan.
    you do not have to bring in the fifth ranked parametre to the front following cnn example and start beating the drum on islam. his belief is his own business. what he did must be condemmed, why did he commit such a hineous act – the investigations are in progress.my first reaction about his profession and the palastinian ethnic background was that is it unusual for psychiatrist to stay healthy working daily with people suffering from mental illnesses and was the murderer of robert kennedy not of a palistinian origin.did we not witness the debacle of hillary clinton last week visit to middle east? my question, i cannot comprehend that a doctor with hand guns can cause such a number of casualties, can we exclude casualties from a friendly cross-fire shooting? this episode must be investigated, not by the military or fbi etc. but the indepedent judiciary and if possible by the united nations.at least americans have the right to know if major hassan had any affiliation with foreign terrorists.our thoughts and prayers should be with the families of victims.

  8. Rashid

    @YLH:
    You read my mind, when you wrote:
    “After all no one forced Nadal Hasan to join the US Army. Once he joined it was his moral duty to stand by his fellow officers in the uniform and live by the code that was applicable to him. If he was so disaffected why didn’t he leave the army first? Why didn’t he migrate back to his ancestral homeland? He didn’t because America gave him an education, a first rate one at Virginia Tech, and livelihood. And America trusted him with the lives of its finest and bravest without any thought about his faith.”

    MY QUESTION:
    I wonder why Muslim serving in US armed forces, are not willing to kill Muslims in enemies armies, when Muslims in Indian army are willing to kill Pakistani Muslims in Pakistan army; Iraqi Muslims are willing to kill Iranian Muslims and vice verse; Hamas men are willing to kill Fatah men and vice versa?????

  9. Mustafa Shaban

    Agreed with PMA: The act was brutal and unneccessary and should not have happened. But this can be explained as being the result of the imperialistic foreign policy of the US towards the Islamic world. The brutality of the US might have driven him to commit this horrible act.

  10. yasserlatifhamdani

    Ofcourse this has everything to do with one particular interpretation of Islam that is becoming commonplace.

    Let us not kid ourselves. Let us reform.

    And disagreement “imperialist” policy is not a good enough answer… the honorable thing in that case would have been for Major Hasan to quit the Army and give up his US Citizenship….

    But he didn’t do any of that…

  11. yasserlatifhamdani

    PMA writes: And certainly let us not get into our habitual blame game: “Mullah did it.”

    I will certainly blame those radical clerics which allow such twisted interpretations of the faith. If you don’t want to… don’t… but don’t expect me to sit silently like a coward on the sidelines.

  12. Milind Kher

    YLH,

    There is a lot of balance and a transparent honesty in your article. If more Pakistanis in particular and Muslims in general could think like you, this world would be a far better place.

    As an ummah, we need to go beyond peaceful coexistence with other communities, and have to proactively reach out to others. Islam is synonymous with peace, progress and Universal brotherhood. This face of Islam, alas, lies hidden behind a veil, so only mahrams can testify to its beauty.

  13. Vajra

    @Milind Kher

    I was not particularly happy with your statement. Would you mind terribly – would you stop talking to me? for instance – if i amended it a little?

    If more Pakistanis in particular and Muslims in general could think like you, this world would be a far better place.

    Suppose this read instead

    If more people, and members of all religions in general could think like you, this world would be a far better place.

    While I quite understand the irresistible urge to reach out and pat these clever Pakistanis on the head when they do something particularly intelligent and democratic and sane, it does seem sometimes that a little introspection, a little mirror-gazing might not go entirely amiss.

  14. PMA

    Yasser: You are jumping the gun. Fox News has done the same. Neither you, sitting ten thousand miles away in Lahore, nor Fox News knows for sure why Dr. Hassan opened fire on his fellow Americans and fellow service men at Fort Hood in the USA. American Muslims are not lead or so easily influenced by ‘mullah’ as you may think. Let us not blame his religion prematurely. There is no prove or evidence at this stage that he was a ‘mullah’ or inspired by a ‘mullah’ to do what he did. Just hold back on your judgement. You could pick your fights with ‘mullahs’ someplace else, but not here and not in this case. The facts are not out yet. Hold back.

  15. yasserlatifhamdani

    So far the evidence points conclusively in the direction that I have pointed to…. the man used to quiz returning soldiers on why they were fighting in Afghanistan… on several occasions he got into altercations with other officers and declared that Muslims should rise up … and he was passing out the Qurans to his neighbors.

    Plus there is that footage of him in full Arab ethnic garb in that convenience store trying to shock the people in uniform (though they didn’t seem shocked)… in all likelihood the guy suffered from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder of the Pure O kind… but let us not forget that OCD more likely has its roots in religion. Look for signs… he will declare very clearly that he did it because he was convinced that Allah was asking him to do so. Look for signs in history… he used to extol the greatness of America to his cousins in Palestine.

    The point is that Major Hassan is a victim of circumstance… the real problem lies with the doctors of religion who’ve given such twisted interpretation to Islam that it forced a person with no small amount of trauma into an internal conflict about the country that fed him and what he felt was his Islamic duty. Major Hasan is as big a victim of these radical clerics as those he killed.

    As a lawyer I would plead his case like this:

    1. Insanity i.e. severe untreated OCD.

    2. The fault lies with Ulema of the Islamic World.

    3. I would probably ask for his imam to be brought in as witness and questioned.

    I would love to plead this case for the defence. In the process, I would expose the real criminals… the ignorant and intolerant imams who’ve turned our religion’s mosques and religious schools into temples of bigotry.

  16. PMA

    Yasser: You will plead his case and loose it. Because you will be unable to prove your preconceived notion that: “mullah made him do it.” What evidence have you? All of your information is second hand, third hand and fourth hand. You heard something in the media and ran with it. Now you are stuck in quick sand and don’t know how to get out. What you really want to do is to denigrate religion Islam and ‘mullah’. As I said to you before. Your fight is with ‘mullahs’ in Pakistan. Go ahead. No one is stopping you from that fight. But stay out of ‘American Muslims’ and ‘Islam in America’ because it is not your field. You are insulting the intelligence of American Muslims that they somehow could so easily be lead by the ‘mullahs’. The man was born, raised and educated in America. He is an American, product of this country. He had emotional problems by serving an army involved in two wars in the Middle East. He flipped under pressure and lost his sanity. It is a matter for American military and its servicemen to sort out. Even American government is not charging him with what you are doing here at PTH. There are American servicemen who have committed similar crimes who are not Muslims. Did ‘mullah’ made them do it? Your beef is with Pakistani ‘mullahs’. Stick with that. Do not enter into areas which you know very little of. Do not use this tragic incidence to prove your case against ‘mullahs’. There is nothing in here for you.

  17. A

    @Rashid
    Very apt question

  18. Hossp

    I have an entirely different take on this issue. I think the the guy was trying to get out of the army. He was trying to create a situation by getting in arguments, wearing the Arabic garb, and using many other over the top actions so that the army would discharge him on the grounds of insanity, insubordination or any other reason except for the dishonorable discharge.
    I have read very little about him but whatever I see, shows that since the day he decided to get out of the army, he started acting religious. This was a good ploy. It alienated his fellow officers and others in the army but I don’t think his superiors were impressed by that and did not recommend to discharge him. When his hopes were dashed and instead he was ordered to go Afghanistan he flipped.
    Most of the Mullah in the US are constantly under watch and I seriously doubt that they have the guts to preach fanatic stuff that they get away with in Pakistan and many other countries.
    Historically, mullah remains a servant of the authorities. This is not likely that he was under the
    Mullah influence. He was an educated person with some stupid notions in his head. He tried to pull the religion to get the discharge. When that did not work, he simply lost it. Sht like this happens in the US all the time, this time around the perpetrator happened be from the wrong community.

  19. Rashid

    @PMA
    November 8, 2009 at 10:21 pm

    Your: “American Muslims are not lead or so easily influenced by ‘mullah’ as you may think.”

    PMA, on the surface you are correct. But the fact is immigrant Muslims in USA in the bottom of their hearts do NOT differ far from interpretation of Islam that Talibans and Mullahs hold. If you go to mosques across USA, you will see good percentage, and in many cases majority, of educated immigrant Muslims who hold degrees in engineering etc with beards or otherwise and dressed, which I consider shabbily, and they consider it a sign of humbleness (Ajizi, and Inkisari). For them it is just a matter of time, may be 100 years, when they gain more strength in this country in every aspect and then demand from Infidels to accept Islam. Luckily, this will not happen, because in next 100 years people will come to know the rational, peaceful, tolerant, inspiring message of Islam. And immigrant Muslims of today, who in their hearts are not different than Mullahs, will not be around or their understanding of Islam will change.

    Your: “Let us not blame his religion prematurely.”

    I agree we should NOT blame his religion, but definitely his (Maj. Hasan) understanding of religion. It is not premature to assume that.

  20. Rashid

    PMA
    November 9, 2009 at 1:05 am

    Your: “But stay out of ‘American Muslims’ and ‘Islam in America’ because it is not your field. You are insulting the intelligence of American Muslims that they somehow could so easily be lead by the ‘mullahs’.”

    PMA, issue is NOT whether American Muslims are under influence of “Mullahs” or not.
    The issue is what is their understanding of Islam. If it is not different from the Mullahs, then it is the same thing. Do a litmus test: Ask your American Muslim friends: Does Islam allows Muslims to be friends with Jews and Christians??? You will be amazed with the majority of answers. And then you ask the same question to Muslims in conservative Muslim countries. You will see identical results.

    In my opinion the Black Muslims in USA have the best understanding of Islam. Firstly, because they do NOT bring the baggage of Immigrant Muslim Understanding of Islam. And secondly their Imams use Translation and commentary of Holy Quran by Maulana Muhammad Ali (of Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement) and Allama Nuruddin (teacher of Maulana Muhammad Ali and student of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian). It was Maulana Muhammad Ali whose English Translation reached into hands of Black American Muslims, first. Imam Waris (Warith) Deen Muhammad used Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement (LAM) literature extensively, and also visited LAM headquarters when he made his first overseas trip in 1975. And of course his teacher was Mubaligh (missionary) in USA Abdullah of LAM.

  21. Rashid

    @ Hossp
    November 9, 2009 at 7:09 am

    Your: “He was an educated person with some stupid notions in his head.”

    Brother UBL is an “educated” person. Physicians who did terrorist attack in UK in 2007 were “educated” persons.
    These stupid acts of Muslims are due to their STUPID interpretation/ understanding of Islam. Education does nothing to them to make them a good human.

  22. Rashid

    CORRECTION:
    Brother Hossp, the STUPID UBL is an “educated” person. Physicians who did terrorist attack in UK in 2007 were “educated” persons

  23. Rashid

    CORRECTION:

    Brother Hossp, the STUPID UBL is an “educated” person. Physicians who did terrorist attack in UK in 2007 were “educated” persons

  24. Milind Kher

    Vajra,

    I agree in principle with what you are saying. The mirror gazing that needs to be done is part of an ongoing philosophy.

    However, here I was specifically addressing Pakistan and Muslims because the world view of these entities is very different from what reflected in the writings of YLH

  25. Hossp

    the STUPID UBL is an “educated” person. Physicians who did terrorist attack in UK in 2007 were “educated” persons


    Let’s not stretch it any further than necessary. Physicians in UK or OBL had entirely different motives. This guy was playing his own game for his own benefit, when that did not work, he flipped.

  26. Rashid

    @Hossp:
    “This guy was playing his own game for his own benefit, when that did not work, he flipped.”

    Yes, it is possible what you are saying. But i still maintain his crooked understanding of religion predisposed him into flipping this way. Look what he has been doing in the days and hours leading to his flipping. Just track his behavior.

    As i have said else where. Unfortunately again VICTIM is Islam and perpetrators are followers of Islam (i.e. Muslim) and opponents of Islam (non-Muslims). Now again POOR Islam is on the receiving end of bad rap, in media.

  27. swapnavasavdutta

    You do not have to kill people to
    get out of the army.
    He could have perhaps just threatened
    to kill people and may be shoot in the
    air, or he could have may be threatened
    people in the Mall, not sure whether
    there is a mall in Kileen but for sure
    there is one in Temple, TX which
    is very close to Fort Hood.

    There are so many other ways to
    attract attention than killing people.

  28. wajid

    Its amazing to see that people think that Mullah’s in US are any different than they are in Pakistan. And that “Black muslims have a better understanding of Islam than other”. ‘Mullah’ is a wider term, used here, reflects the nutjobs who twist and exploit the religion. that means every religion has its own set of mullahs.

    A big majority of Black Muslims were converted by, Jamaat al-Fuqra, also described as a cult, has been involved in illegal activities. I have done a lot of work on such organizations, and JaF is one of the organizations currently under investigation by US authorities for charges ranging from links with terrorist groups to laundering money into Pakistan. So, its no surprise if the man was influenced anyway by “Mullahs”.

  29. Rashid

    @wajid
    November 9, 2009 at 11:07 am

    I am talking about Imams in mosques run by Imams of Imam Waris (Warith) Deen Muhammad organization.

  30. Rashid

    @swapnavasavdutta
    November 9, 2009 at 9:47 am

    You made good points.
    Unfortunately, mostly Muslims in order to defend a fellow Muslim come will all kinds of excuses.
    Unless Muslims start correcting their fellow Muslims and stop them from acting on stupid thoughts, condition of Muslims won’t change.
    Muslims need to go a long way…

  31. wajid

    Rashid: it definitely comes down to the understanding of religion, but right now – the given circumstances, most people are influenced by the so called clergy institution. A shady mullah in US is considered more educated than a Mullah in any 3rd world country, which is a wrong notion.
    And i fear this perception will not go away until unless followers start questioning the religion as well as the preacher.

  32. Vajra

    @Milind Kher

    I did get it, and your basic point is valid, and appreciated, it’s just that I don’t agree that because the world has that view at this moment, we can afford to share it, knowing better (it is to be hoped that we do know better). Is it that the observation is only true for a specific period in time, and that it was not true earlier, and need not be true later?

    At the same time, I admit that PTH is far from representative of the majority, and we are, as you said in slightly different words, speaking to a very special group of people. It still won’t prevent annoying the readership and setting their teeth on edge, as they are more likely to identify themselves with the wholesale criticism of Pakistanis and Muslims than with your observation that YLH (as symbolic of that set) is different.

    I submit that while we are not going to be pulled up specifically on this remarkably broad-minded blog, we do need to remain sensitive to what we are saying, and the implications of those words. And in any case, we could properly universalise your observations for the edification of a larger set, and not confine ourselves to joining in with what almost appears to be a sycophantic jeer at whoever is the butt of the teacher’s negative attention at this moment. People who have problems and have realised it may not relish being told in public in strident and ringing tones that they have problems.

  33. Rashid

    @Wajid:
    You said it: And i fear this perception will not go away until unless followers start questioning the religion as well as the preacher.

    I can’t tell you how many times I have argued with Imams after the Khutba. If you talk to other mosque attendees they will be in-different. Either they don’t know or they don’t care. They go to Friday mosque just because they were born Muslims. And as a Muslim they are required to offer Friday prayers in mosque. They leave their religion to their Imams. If you disagree with Imam couple of times, he will start questioning your faith and start labeling your sect with his like-minded worshippers.

  34. wajid

    exactly! questioning is considered as a sin, its like you are challenging the authority of god and holy book. usually, the perception is, and its across the board unfortunately, that ‘mullah’ is quoting from holy book, so whatever he is saying is authentic, and if you dare ask, his goons might kill you, if not label you anything.

  35. Majumdar

    Yasser Pai,

    I would love to plead this case for the defence. In the process, I would expose the real criminals… the ignorant and intolerant imams who’ve turned our religion’s mosques and religious schools into temples of bigotry.

    It wud be an interesting irony, wudn’t it. Years back our beloved Qaid (pbuh) had made a similar plea for another young man who had killed after being led astray by mullahs. That man- Ghazi Shahid Ilamaddin- I believe was…. ahem…. well known to you.

    Regards

  36. yasserlatifhamdani

    Yes… “Ghazi” Ilmdin “Shaheed” was an older cousin of grandfather. Barely 14, my grandfather went to visit him in jail.

    M A Jinnah was engaged on the appeal stage. Mr. Jinnah’s arguments – in the high court appeal- were -as per the record- twofold. First Mr. Jinnah came out and declared that the young man was innocent and was just passing by.

    Once that ploy failed… and the prosecution presented its eye witnesses… Mr. Jinnah declared that Ilmdin was a young man of 19 or 20 who was riled up by the Mullah in the mosque. The court in its judgment pointed to an earlier precedent saying that the argument i.e. young man of 19 or 20 no longer held validity.

    PMA

    The irony is that the only way anyone can win a case like this is to argue insanity + culpability of the radical clerics…

  37. yasserlatifhamdani

    “But stay out of ‘American Muslims’ and ‘Islam in America’ because it is not your field.”

    I am very intimately connected to American Muslims and Islam in America… much more than you can imagine.

    Search Yasser Latif Hamdani + Rutgers + ISRU on google. In the future don’t go about telling me what I can do or not do. Who are you to tell me this?

    http://www.chowk.com/articles/14302

    Infact… when it comes to ignorance, stupidity and just plain hypocrisy the American Muslims win hands down vis a vis Pakistanis. In my opinion Siraj Wahajj, Hamza Yusuf and other Imams and other backward “Shaiyookh” who gather every year at ISNA and ICNA are misleading the one section of the Ummah that could lead the way …. instead of encouraging American Muslims excel in science, technology and business, these American Imams are telling people to join “Zaytuna” and converge on Washington for a mass Juma prayer on Capitol Hill …. If ever anyone wanted to see how the clerics keep the Muslim community backward in a minority situation, USA would be test case… where the state gives every opportunity for the citizen to progress but the citizen is kept behind by his or her own imams.

  38. wajid

    Damn, you are so right, and don’t leave ‘care’ out of that list too.

  39. Majumdar

    If ever anyone wanted to see how the clerics keep the Muslim community backward in a minority situation

    There must be some Gandhi-Nehru type Yank X-tian leader who must be goading on these mullahs.

    Regards

  40. yasserlatifhamdani

    Yes… I pointed that out in my Chowk Article…

    The US Government …. the current President who speaks about Taraweeh in his Ramadan message (without regard to the fact that many sects of Islam don’t recognize Taraweeh atleast in the form that it is practised in Sunni Islam)… the Bush Administration which invited Hamza Yusuf to Congress joint session as president’s special guest on state of union… etc etc.

  41. Rashid

    Trivia on Hamza Yousaf:

    Hamza Yusuf in private will highly praise Maulana Muhammad Ali (of Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement) works on Islam e.g. ‘Religion of Islam’ or Holy Quran translation and commentary, but publicly he dares not to even show little appreciation.
    What should it be called??? A smart strategy or dishonesty! Problem is if people like him lack courage to speak the truth, who else will? And stupid Mullahs will keep control on brains of Muslims.

  42. Majumdar

    Yes… I pointed that out in my Chowk Article…etc.

    Well, maybe it is true after all that Yahoods, Hanoods and Nasaras are indeed all united in a conspiracy to keep Muslims backward

    Regards

  43. yasserlatifhamdani

    That is a rather cynical way of putting it. Atleast on part of Yahood-0-Nasara I cannot read any such conspiracy.

    As for Gandhi… I feel perhaps that he felt that only religious people could lead … indeed the other day a very respected Shia Alim of Khomeniite clan on a TV Show I was on made the same point i.e. good leadership needs religious underpinning. This in my view is the folly that led Gandhiji down that path.

  44. yasserlatifhamdani

    Rashid,

    I have heard Hamza Yusuf openly declare that Lahori Ahmadis are Muslims… but with “fusaaq” in their “aqeedah”.

  45. Milind Kher

    Vajra,

    I agree with you that the people on this blog are by and large broad minded. That is why I believe that they may be amenable to accepting my point of view. If it were a blog of bigots, I would not have posted at all.

    On the other hand, if there are people whose sensitivities are going to be offended, don’t they need to ponder about how they are being perceived.

    It is always healthy to introspect and correct oneself, is it not?

  46. Majumdar

    Yasser Pai,

    Atleast on part of Yahood-0-Nasara I cannot read any such conspiracy.

    But Hanoods are certainly a part of such a conspiracy. I had suspected as much.

    Regards

  47. D_a_n

    @YLH…

    which TV show was that? any youtube clip?

    Also:

    ‘indeed the other day a very respected Shia Alim of Khomeniite clan on a TV Show I was on made the same point i.e. good leadership needs religious underpinning.’

    not surprising since he was Khomeniite due to their automatic belief in Vilayat e Faqih….

  48. yasserlatifhamdani

    Hey Dan…

    Let me know if you can find it. It was Roshan Pakistan with Faisal Rahman… on NewsOne….

    The Shia Alim was Agha Murtaza Poya.

  49. Mustafa Shaban

    I really like Shiekh Hamza Yusuf, he is very knowledgeable on Islam and he is a convert so he studied Islam before entering it. He is very different from the mullahs and is not an extremist, he also wants to bring back education but with an Islamic spirit to it, whats wrong with that?

    Also I agree with PMA: There have been many such incidences in the past with christian and Jewish soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan who have shot their friends and then committed suicide themselves. If you look at the US Army, the moral is very low and it is a psychological hell. Reports are showing a rapid increase in mental illness and psychological illness in the US Army. The jihadist/mullah ideology may have contributed to the horrific act but it was not the primary reason for why it happened. I do not think the Jewish and christian soldiers who committed such acts in the past decade follow any mullah.

    Also I think people have the wrong perception here. People confuse heavy conservatism with extremist. Many Muslims are very conservative but it is only 1-2% Muslims around the world that are radical. Most others are moderate.

    The media portrays the wrong image especially Fox News regarding this incident.

  50. PMA

    General Casey has publicly stated that so for there is no evidence of Major Hasan’s involvement in any terrorist plot. All indications are that he was suffering under post traumatic depression syndrome and he acted alone. FBI has also said the same, although in its investigation it will not rule out all other possibilities. The military is acting responsibly in its handling of the case and is being very careful not to give the incidence an ethnic and religious color. Military with its sizable Muslim representation is concerned about the morale of the armed forces. This was a criminal act of a serviceman in uniform, committed on a military base against other servicemen. There is all likelihood that he will be charged and tried under military law. Military is not trying to rope-in “culpability of the radical clerics.”

    On the other hand Senator Joseph Lieberman–a conservative Jew, a Zionist and an ardent supporter of the state of Israel–has appeared on the right-wing conservative Fox News known for its bias against Muslims and minorities, and stated his suspicions of Major Hasan being an Islamic Fundamentalist and a terrorist. Ironically a position very similar to that of Mr. Yasser Lateef Hamadani.

  51. yasserlatifhamdani

    Senator Joe Lieberman is also a Democrat not a Republican. But let us forget that little inconvenient detail. Just because X, Y and Z share an opinion with me is not a good enough reason for me to change my point of view…

    That the radical clerics will not be brought to justice yet again… is just another step in the wrong direction.

    Major Hasan is the victim of radical clerics and the cancer that is eating American Muslims from within. I am not sure who accused him of being part of a terrorist plot other than that which he carried out all alone. His motivation is what we are discussing here and not the likelihood of a great terrorist plot by Al Qaeda. His motivation comes very directly from an interpretation of the faith given by radical clerics … including but not limited to the ignorant Shaikh Hamza Yusuf who once described United States as the “Great Dajjal”.

  52. PMA

    Yasser: I am not trying for you to change your position. I am simply trying to show you the fallacy of your position in this particular case. Today both Military and the FBI have stated that so far based on all the data collected there is no clear indication of the motives behind the criminal act of Major Hasan. He is not even formally charged. Technically he is still a ‘suspect. You on the other hand keep on insisting that “His motivation comes very directly from an interpretation of the faith given by radical clerics …”. You my friend have already charged, tried and convicted him; all based upon your now familiar theme: “Mullah did it.”

    And by the way. Senator Lieberman is neither Democrat nor Republican. In his last election due to his conservative views he was denied the Democratic party ticket. He ran as an independent and with the backing of his Jewish/conservative friends he defeated his Democratic as well as Republican opponents. Due to his anti-Muslim and anti-Arab views he is not very popular with American Muslims. It is hard to ignore that in this particular case you sir, the liberal-progressive-secular Yasser Lateef Hamadani, stand with conservative Lieberman and Fox News.

  53. yasserlatifhamdani

    Joe Lieberman was also Al Gore’s Vice presidential candidate. He is very much a democratic old hand.

    Ofcourse… what I am saying is also being echoed not just by Lieberman… but extreme right wing elements in the US political spectrum… but does that mean I should change my view? I don’t care even if Frank Graham agrees with me… or Bill O Reily agrees with me..

    I am not sure how you feel my position is fallacious when by your own admission, nothing has been decided.

    Major Hasan is not the culprit. Radical Islamist clerics and people like Shaikh Hamza Yusuf are the culprits. I have not tried and convicted Major Hasan… on the contrary, I have given you the real situation which might acquit him and spare his life. Let us not let a troubled and depressed man like Major Hasan go to the gallows because you want to save the clerics.

  54. Milind Kher

    Even if only 1-2% of Muslims are radical, they are very visible.

    It is they who give the saffron brigade and the Islamophobic sections of the press a stick to beat the ummah with.

    Sikhs in Punjab categorically rejected the Khalistani terrorists. Thus, they lost their popular base and the movement died down.

    Muslims could also take a leaf out of their book and defeat the enemy within

  55. PMA

    Yasser I will tell you where you are wrong. You are wrong when you say:

    “we will no doubt realize that this tragedy has its roots in an erroneous interpretation of Islam favored by some radical clerics”

    That is where you are wrong. You do not know for fact that his act has roots in his religious believes, erroneously interpreted or not. You do not know for fact that he was influenced by radical clerics. You are just speculating. Just like Joe Lieberman and those hatemongers at Fox News. I know it would be hard for you to retract your words. So I will let you go this time. Please be careful next time around. Bye now.

  56. yasserlatifhamdani

    His actions have absolutely everything to do with twisted interpretations of Islam by radical clerics.

  57. Rashid

    @YLH:
    your: I have heard Hamza Yusuf openly declare that Lahori Ahmadis are Muslims… but with “fusaaq” in their “aqeedah”.

    Thanks for info. i didnot know that. I wish i can ask him why he thinks Lahori Ahmadis have “fusaaq” in their “aqeedah”?
    Is it because Lahori ahmadis belief is that Holy Prophet Muhammad SAWS was THE LAST AND FINAL messangr of Allah SWT, and Jesus is D-E-A-D?
    Believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was a Mujjaddid (reformer) of 14th Hijra is NOT must. Actually in his pledge (ba’it) terms he ONLY used word ‘BROTHER’ for himself.

  58. Milind Kher

    I am not too sure about this. Yet, I believe that Ahmadis are divided into the Lahore Anjuman and Qadiani Anjuman, and it is only thev Qadiani Anjuman that believes Mirza Ghulam Ahmed to have been a prophet.

  59. yasserlatifhamdani

    I think it was Jesus’ death in particular…

  60. Milind Kher

    The Qur’an rejects the crucifixion of Christ.

    That being said, it is erroneous to believe that Jesus(a.s.) is dead.

    In fact, he will join Imam Mahdi (a.t.f.s.) in doing battle with Dajjal (l.a.)

  61. wajid

    PMA: this is one is especially for you:

    US intelligence agencies learned that Army Major Nidal Hasan was trying to make contacts with Al Qaeda months ago, according to ABC News (NOT FOX!!).
    It is unknown if these agencies informed the Army. Hasan also attended a mosque run by a radical imam named Anwar al Awlaki in Falls Church, Virginia at the same time as two of the 9/11 hijackers, though it is unknown if there was ever any contact between them. Now living in Yemen, Alwaki blogged on Monday, “Nidal Hassan Did the Right Thing.”

  62. Mustafa Shaban

    @PMA: totally agreed with you, YLH is repeating the same stuff that the hawkish element s in both the republican and democratic party are saying including the zionists.

    @wajid: tell me one thing, US intellegence agencies werre saying that Iraq has WMD’s. Where are they now?hey just disappeared into thin air? Thay also gave the naems of the 19 hijackers..later it was found out that 11 of them are alive and well. So much for intellegence. ABC News or FOIX or any american corporate channel puts forth only propoganda becuase they are owned by corporations and are in bed with government.

  63. yasserlatifhamdani

    Mustafa Shaban mian,

    Does it matter who is agreeing with me? So far everything seems to point towards the fact that radical clerics were behind Major Hasan’s terrorist act.

  64. wajid

    Dear Shaban: the intelligence agencies in the States actually reported that there were no WMDs in Iraq. That followed numerous resignations and accusations on the Bush administration.
    The decision to go in was taken by the then VP. You obviously don’t know the history and sequence of events involved in the Iraq insurgency, but am glad that you asked.

  65. Rashid

    @Milind Kher
    November 9, 2009 at 10:35 pm
    The Qur’an rejects the crucifixion of Christ.
    That being said, it is erroneous to believe that Jesus(a.s.) is dead.

    MK it is NOT true that Holy Quran rejects Jesus AS death. Actually to the contrary it say Jesus AS is dead.

    Please check it in Muhammad Asad translation and commentary of Holy Quran. Actually, translators and commentators of HQ who were FREE from Mullah-Mafia influence/ terrorism, e.g. in Europe they wrote Jesus AS is dead. Bosian scholars wrote the same thing. British scholars did the same. Anyway check following article by some one who is NOT Ahmadi, neither Lahori nor Qadiani.

    Sorry I can not post link because of this blog filter.
    Plz go to:
    www dot ahmadiyya dot org
    and see under
    Islam
    See Full Contents
    Then scroll down to
    Death of Jesus according to Islamic Sources.

    Editor’s Note: Rashid, you were warned before, not once but many times not to use this website to propagate your religious views. You are being put on spam list at least for three weeks for now. Hopefully this will give you enough time to realize that PTH is not a communal/sectarian “I am righter than you” forum (AZW)

  66. yasserlatifhamdani

    Wow… Adnan that is pretty cool…. you’ve got to show me how you did this🙂

  67. Pingback: Depressive Syndrome » Terrible Tragedy at Fort Hood Texas « Pak Tea House

  68. rexminor

    as a guest i get the impression that whenever something around the world happens the internet twitters start a game of speculative explanations and bring out their own grievences in the fore-.have you ever considered that the reason for turmoils in several parts of the world is simply related to the forced or voluntary renditions which take place.despite creating a homeland pakistan bickering is caused by most of the urdu speaking indian migrants who refused to integrate with locals starting from mr jinnah, various palastinians cum jordonians and egyptians arrival in britain seeking political assylum in the seventies and then took over the vacant posts of preachers in the mosques giving their interpretation of islam to the british born muslims. every muslim should know that there is no middle man between him and the god almighty.how come therefore that most blame the radical clergy(mullahs) for their his own mistakes.the british as well as other european govts. should not have allowed the entry of natives from other countries unless were of the opinion that these people accept the culture and the traditions of the land.likewise,successive military takeovers and their misrule coupled with civilian govt. disregard for peoples welfare and education have turned pakistan into a failed state.it is futile to blame the current state of affairs on india or muslim clergy on the misery of the land.to imagine that major hassan was influenced by the clergy or became insane and a sharp shooter doctor is a misread of human intelligence.one day he will tell the world why he flipped and we should listen,just listen to him.

  69. D_a_n

    @rexminor….

    ‘pakistan bickering is caused by most of the urdu speaking indian migrants who refused to integrate with locals starting from mr jinnah’

    Good Lord man….even the finest grade Afghan shit cant get you that high.. (not that I would ever know ofcourse)..

  70. Dcmediagirl

    @PMA: You seem to be completely obsessed with Joe Lieberman. I’ve disliked him for as long as I’ve worked in politics and find him immensely irritating and opportunistic.

    BUT.

    By annointing Lieberman as the King of All Bigots you ignore the obvious fact that the vast majority of American politicians who openly air their anti-Muslim views on Fox and talk radio are Christians…and predominantly from the South.

    In fact, Jews make up the majority of members of civil rights and free speech organizations that are demonized by the knuckle-draggers at Fox.

    But hey, if you really want to go with that fashionable Jew hatred knock yourself out.

  71. Mustafa Shaban

    @Dcmediagirl: You aere right, i agree with you, but PMA is not critizinzing jews or is against jews. The main concern is of the christian and jewish zionists in congress and in government who are shouting anti muslim slogans.

    Also what work do you do or used to do in politics? Just wondering. Also where are you from? if you do not mind me asking.

  72. PMA

    Dcmediagirl: November 11, 2009 at 7:13 am

    Dear DC Media Girl: You got me wrong. My comments are not about Jews or Christians. My comments are about Fox News and its shameful anti-Muslim campaign. What happened at Fort Hood is a terrible terrible thing. Unfortunately Fox News and some other Christian Conservative Radio and TV talk show hosts are using this tragic incidence for their anti-Muslim campaign. They are creating a very dangerous situation for American Muslims. We do not know your real identity as you are posting under a pseudonyme, but you say that you are a ‘media girl’. Well then you would know what I am talking about. About Lieberman. His anti-Muslim and anti-Arab feeling are well known. He is the first one who appeared on Fox and suggested that the incident should be investigated as a terrorist case. He is the first one who called Major Hasan as an Islamic Terrorist. And for the record. I am not a ‘Jew hatter’. I just don’t like the politics of Joe Lieberman.

  73. DCMediagirl

    I don’t like Joe Lieberman either. I’ve never liked him, even when he claimed to be a “Democrat.” But to suggest that Joe Lieberman’s views are in any way representative of the Jewish community as a whole, a community which as I mentioned skews liberal and has been at the forefront of defending everything from civil rights to free speech to Guantanamo detainees, is about as logical and fair as my making the lunatic Fort Hood shooter the ambassador of all Muslims worldwide. I find it interesting that given the wide selection of creeps, bigots and ignoramuses that spout their racist views on Fox day and night that you would keep singling out Joe Lieberman. Try Glenn Beck. Or Rush Limbaugh. Or Sean Hannity. Or Bill O’Reilly. Or Michelle Malkin. Or Laura Ingraham. Or Ann Coulter. There’s plenty to choose from.

  74. DCMediagirl

    Michelle Malkin, by the way, advocates rounding up Muslims and putting them in internment camps. She’s a bestselling author and frequently guest hosts for O’Reilly. I’d be far more worried about her influence than Joe Lieberman’s. He has no base of support whatsoever and politically speaking is the equivalent of a two-headed cow.

  75. Bloody Civilian

    @DCMediagirl

    But to suggest that Joe Lieberman’s views are in any way representative of the Jewish community as a whole

    i missed that. who said that? where?

  76. PMA

    DCMediagirl: We are not talking about any community. Neither Jewish, nor Christian, nor Muslim. So let us get off that. What I am saying is that there are some who are using this tragic incident to fan anti-Muslim sentiments. Joe Lieberman is one of many. And anti-Muslim and anti-Arab rhetoric is not limited to any one religious community. As for as Jewish community goes, you will find Jews in liberal as well as in conservative camps. And same goes for other religious communities as well. Bye now.