Yes, Varun Gandhi is a scary bigot

Raza Rumi

PTH’s post and the subsequent sharp comments have attracted some ire among the readers as to what is Varun Gandhi issue doing here? Indeed, the question merits some deliberation. We in Pakistan are constantly being demonised by the Indian mainstream media as a ‘terrorist’ country and that we are a great threat to the ‘secular’, shining India. Varun gandhi’s remarks as the saner elements of Indian media and commentators are saying only show that people have gotten away with such crap. The fissures in the secular Indian democracy get even more evident when such speeches are delivered.

Varun Gandhi’s remarks on Muslims, hate speech that goes beyond all measures of ‘hate speech’ concerns us as it only exposes us to brigades of hatred, communalism and violence across the border. If our jihadis or Islamists get inordinate attention then why should a bigoted idiot like the young Gandhi not worry us? Imagine if by a stroke of misfortune he comes to power surely we are all set to be chopped off as we – the Muslims – have ‘scary’ names; and that Pakistan would be the next target once Narendara Modi-esque pogroms are completed against Indian Muslims.

The shining stars of India – the big business including the Tatas, Mittals and Ambanis – have cited Modi as their preferred choice for the next Prime Minister. Scary? Absolutely. Yes we don’t have a great record of protecting our minorities but then the tall claims of India and its leadership fall flat when Modi not only rules as a Chief Minister but is a choicest candidate for capitalists with billion dollar homes and ownerships of international cartels.

Indian Election Commission has taken note of Varun Gandhi’s criminal speech and hopefully they will proceed against him.

The truth is that state failure is evident in all countries of South Asia where constitutions, laws and rules are nothing but instruments in the hands of caste, communalism, militarism and jingoism of nation states.

Shame on Varun Gandhi and shame on his supporters who want to save him – the key defender being another hate-guru Bal Thackery.

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80 Comments

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80 responses to “Yes, Varun Gandhi is a scary bigot

  1. NRI

    Firstly Varun Gandhi will never rise to become a significant figure in Indian politics and secondly if by fluke even if he does he will will no such thing against Indian Muslims he has to sustain his political career after all but Pakistaniteahouse has surely found some ways to increase traffic and Comments on his blog which just a few days back had only 5 comments [:D] here to kick start the comments riot…..khush raho yaar.

  2. NRI

    Firstly Varun Gandhi will never rise to become a significant figure in Indian politics and secondly if by fluke even if he does he will do no such thing against Indian Muslims, he has to sustain his political career after all, but Pakiteahouse has surely found some ways to increase traffic and Comments on his blog which just a few days back had only 5 comments [:D] here to kick start the comments riot…..khush raho yaar.

  3. Indian

    If India was like Pakistan, RSS would have been the ruling party since Babri masjid demolition. If India was like Pakistan , Id and Christmas would not have been a holiday in every school and college for last 60 years.
    BJP came to power and it did what every sensible govt does, let civil servants and business heads do their jobs behind the scenes.
    Nobody needs to waste their time differentiating India from Pak. It is all open for everybody to see. Pakistan is struggling to survive and India is a powerhouse. Not to deny , that there is no poverty or communalism in India, but that they are not mainstream and will never be.
    The key to solving a problem is accepting it in the first place which Pakistan is not ready to do and which is that fabric of Pak society and nation starts and ends with religon as the binding thread.

    and may i ask you to answer this simple fact:
    Since independence percentage of muslims in India has increased but that of all minorities put together has fallen in Pak. from near 12% to less than 5%.

  4. Shahzad

    @ NRI

    “Firstly Varun Gandhi will never rise to become a significant figure in Indian politics and secondly if by fluke even if he does he will will no such thing against Indian Muslims”, NRI you have totally missed the point of the debate. It is not really about Varun the individual, it is about the hands that prop him up, you must be naive to believe that someone who’s been in the BJP for 5 years would suddenly say something like that without support from his party. If the BJP and Varun were truly sorry they would apologize and get on with it. But they won’t as that is what they stand for, Modi has never apologized for Gujrat and neither has Advani for Babri masjid. Also, people were saying the same thing about the Nazis all throughout the 30’s till the day they realized it was too late. I am sorry to have to equate this with the German National Socialists but it is sadly the truth.

    @Indian

    Indian my friend it is exactly those liberties that you mentioned that are now under threat, maybe not tomorrow but definitely in the foreseeable future. As for the future of Pakistan, the nation has survived against insurmountable odds for the last 60 years and am sure will continue to do so. There is an underlying resilience within it’s people which the world in general has failed to appreciate for reasons which are not at all clear to me. As for India being a powerhouse the jury’s still out on that on, there are any number of reports from reputable world bodies which can be consulted by anyone if they are so inclined.

    And, no, religion does not bind the Pakistani nation as it was unfortunately proven back in 1971.

    As for the numbers about minorities please don’t pick them out of a hat. Pakistan after partition was a predominantly muslim nation and it’s natural for the minority’s percentage to decrease accordingly with time.

  5. Shahzad

    Raza,

    Thanks for clarifying this. There is and has always been a certain amount of bias against Pakistan when it comes to militant elements who have political support i.e. why are the Pakistani Taliban labeled terrorists and not BJP/RSS when they openly condone and orchestrate terrorist acts in India.

    This is not to say I am a Taliban supporter, but lets call a spade a spade irrespective of it’s nationality. For those who say that Modi has brought significant development to Gujrat, well the Taliban in Afghanistan also nearly eradicated the drug trade when they were in power, “justice” was provided swiftly to the masses and petty crime was on it’s way down. Were it not for 9/11 there would probably now be a pipeline and a highway running through Afghanistan from the central Asian states to Pakistan. We would have had great “development” as well.

  6. M R Lakhanie

    @ Indian
    Its amazing how the Indian government has kept its nation under a haze of lies and deciet … though I must say that’ve done one hell of a job at it. Its the same haze of lies and deciet where you think that a gloomy, poor and hungry India who’s health status equates that of a sub Saharan country is prospering and Shining. Its the same haze that makes u believe that India is a secular country while nuns are raped on a regular basis, conversion of dalits into christianity was met with their death, muslims were burnt alive in gujarat, churches have been razed down while the perpetrators of the heinous massacare of Babri Masjid are still at large!
    India is the ONLY country in the world which is at logger heads with all its neighbours. To elaborate, India has uneasy and hostile relationships with Bangladesh, SriLanka has accused India of supporting Tamil tigers, India and China have fought a war, while even after 60 years of existence India hasnt stopped meddling into Pakistan’s affair.
    On the contrary, Christmas is also a holiday in Pakistan. Thousands of Sikhs visit their holy places in Pakistan every year with the government of Pakistan making special arrangments. Diwali, Holi, Nawratri are big religious festivals celebrated freely by the Hindu community who mostly reside in the province of Sindh. The source-less figures of the minority size decreasing in Pakistan are completely baseless and part of the hate propaganda by the extremist saffron demons of India.
    All in all, India with its tall claims of being Secular and democratic have goons like Narendra Modi and Varun Gandhi who would soon be at the helm of the affairs in India while Pakistan, even though is a muslim country, provides utmost rights to its minority civilians and are an asset to the country.

  7. Topgun

    Raza,

    You are demonised not just by the Indian media but the international media as well. All the labels of “failed state”, “international migraine”, and “the most dangerous state” are given to you by international media. Even Pervez Musharraf, when he was the president, used to refer to his job as the “most dangerous job in the world”. If you are looking at strands of non-events only for the purpose of demonizing India, then they would be always available for your sleuthing pleasure (and in any country)

    India is definitely a seculer country. India does afford equal opportunities to all its citizens, irrespective of religion, cast and creed. That can be proved even by a cursory look at a representative section of India’s population. You can look at politics, Bollywood, Cricket team, private sector, bureaucracy, schools and universities, govenment jobs and then draw your own conclusions. One may ask, why the condition of “xyz” minority so bad and so and so. Let me tell you that Declaration of Amercian Independence was signed centuries ago, and yet Amercia has had its first black president only now. Like Amercia, India has also a lot of past baggage and social complexities to overcome before it can be truly pluralist country. But like USA, we have the right constitution in place and are moving in the right direction. Having the right constitution is the single most important thing to do. And that has served us well in the past, and there is no reason to believe it is not going to do in the future.

    A lot of isolated incidents are pointed out to “demonize” India. Gujrat riots, Babri Masjid demolition, Samjhota blasts etc etc. Step back and look at 1984 – when there were Sikh riots. The story was the same. Bloodshed, ineffective enquiry commissions, no justice. But look at today. Not just is India being led by its first Sikh prime minister who is looking good for a second term, but Sikhs are very progressive and visible in all walks of society. And mind you, they are not even 1% of total Indian population. India has the institutional strength to recover from any systemic faults and correct its course. APJ Abdul Kalam was a Muslim elected to President, and KR Narayanan was dalit elected to president by the widest voting margin in India’s presidential elections. All of them had very huble roots. I dare you to say that all that is farce.

    A lot of comparisons are bandied about Indian economy. The country is worse than Sub-Saharran Africa in Human Index Indicators. Its economic growth is farce. Well, the Indian economy is in transition. Most of the problems with India are applicable to BRIC (Brazil, China, Russia, India) countries as well. All strategic firms like Stratfor, Rand or financial firms like Goldman Sachs, World Bank have a positive outlook for the future of India. India has lifted a third of its people out of poverty in the last decade alone. Every year 1% of its population crosses over from poverty to Middle class. India runs the largest “soup kitchen” program of the world (free education and hot meals). That program is only expanding. India has changed a lot in the last 10 years. And it is not slowing down by any means. By 2025, World Bank estimates a majority of Indians would be middle class. All that has been achieved through democratic system – no mean achievement by any standards.

  8. I come at this from an angle of a Pakistani who likes India and admits the veracity of much that “Indian” is saying in this comment thread.

    However, my criticism of Pakistan and Muslims is now extending to other countries (and that includes India) as well and I come from a position of despair rather than righteousness.

    I will quote the following from a recent post of mine regarding Slumdog Millionaire and this very issue of India becoming increasingly intolerant and bigoted:

    “When a people start embracing nationalism as a dogma, they lose all touch with reality, they lose credibility – they stunt and actually reverse erstwhile progress. Other dogmas feed into it. Religious dogmas. Cultural dogmas. It is a fact that is now openly on display in India and in America, both countries that I once admired.

    The rise of intolerance and fanaticism in India is alarming. What is much more alarming though, is that it is being so widely tolerated and even supported, in the spirit of and in view of the precedent set by America’s War on Terror.

    That the nationalist government of Gujarat orchestrated the killing of more than 2000 Muslims is alarming. What is more alarming is that the mastermind Narendra Modi, even after public airing of tapes of his party’s Hindu Extremists’ open boasting of the rape and beheading of Muslims, was re-elected by an overwhelming majority!

    In Israel the fascist Avigdor Lieberman has gained immense clout and *ordinary* Israelis are supporting him.

    America overwhelmingly supported (at least initially) Bush’s state terrorism that made the devastation caused by terrorists and dictators seem minor by comparison. That completely eroded a lot of good in their own society.

    All this is done in the name of fighting the World Enemy # 1: Islam and Muslim Terrorists. As if the end justifies the means! As if what goes around does not come around. As if an eye for an eye does not, in fact, make the whole world blind. As if the blind can then be excused for not being able to see that their actions and stance places them squarely and surely in the brotherhood of the Mullah Omars and the Al Zawahiris of the world that they claim to be against.”

    Now, I may not be either articulate or credible but anyone seriously invested in shedding light on this issue, do read this article by Pankaj Mishra on the subject. A very thoughtful article indeed that I borrowed from for my post.

  9. Som

    I think you probably erred in your haste to buttress a point you wanted to prove anyway.

    I’m not sure if Varun is a scary bigot. Instead, I suspect it’s his desperation which showed right through his hate speech. But in a democracy, fortunately, he has a right to air his view and face its consequence, both!

    And he is facing it. So much so that he is disowning the speech and claiming the tape is doctored! It really upsets me when you chose to overlook this facet of the story.

    You got to understand that in a democracy, you just can’t muzzle someone because you fear he might say something which amounts to bigotry.

    But yes, it is indeed worrying to see this misled youngster, with no experience or future in politics doing something as silly as this.

  10. YLH

    Indian,

    I am afraid you don’t understand Pakistani society. As Mukul Kesavan hinted to it, Pakistan will never elect religious minded folk as their leaders because they wouldn’t be able to agree on them.

    As for India being powerhouse… Blah blah…the difference between Pakistan and India is that we know our shit stinks…and to repeat what a wise man said: you eat like a halwa (especially you).

  11. Dastagir

    Why is Varun Gandhi “Explaining” his speech when it is doctored ? Fact is : Varun has taken the short-cut to the “Main Headlines”. The Election Commission cannot (will not) do anything except than issue a warning, that Varun will throw in the dustbin. This guy moves around with 20 Armed Goons (Private Armies, of say Hindu Taliban) armed with AK47s. Any Photographer who tries to click, is beaten and his camera smashed. It was a miracle that this came thru.

    His father Sanjay Gandhi said the same things. At that point in time, TV was Govt. controlled and there was no independent Electronic Media. Mrs. Indira Gandhi said the same things (will break hands / chop off legs)… but she had the sophistication to lace it and nuance it. Varun told bluntly, what Sanjay had said 30 yrs back… and what Indira said every 3rd day. This is the language they spoke at home, i suppose… and now it has come out.

    Someone should stand up and say : “Well., IF anyone tries to disturb peace in India and disturb the life of Indians, i will chop off Varun’s **** and throw it to the dogs”. You need this type of political campaign to counter RSS. Court cases wont take far. Thousands of muslims have been slaughtered in Secular and Shining India since 1947-to-date., but not 1 (one) criminal conviction !
    (If someone says this : the immediate spat is : If India is so bad, why dont you go to Pakishtan… or to another 50 Muslim bastis / colonies / countries / whatever. In other words, we know it is the truth, but keep silent !).

    It is people like Narendra Modi and Varun Gandhi who provide fodder for elements like Taliban to thrive in Pakistan. Religious parties have never polled more than 5% in elections in Pak, whereas BJP (which is a mask for RSS and its poisonous branches… 55 of them in all… called sangh parivar or sangh umbrella) is NOW ruling 11 States (Provinces) in India… and major States… not small ones like Manipur. If the Indian people are all human, milk and honey., how come they elected a Terrorist Organisation like BJP/RSS to power in 11 Provinces ?

    How come the film “Ghadar” is a Golden Jubilee Hit while “Delhi-6” flops ! Hatred for Islam/Muslims has entered the sub-consciousness of an average Hindu. He is not willing to listen to the other side of the story. He is not willing to put himself in the other man’s shoes. 80 years of concerted campaign by RSS (aided and abetted by the Congress esp. under Mrs. Indira Gandhi) are now bearing fruit.

    The whole of India is dipped in Hatred for Islam and Muslims., and the immediate whipping boy is Pakistan.

    The unfortunate part is., that this HATRED for the other will ultimately destroy eclectic Hinduism – as a philosophy and as an ideology… but they dont care. They want immediate results of the VICTOR. We will kill the men – steal the utensils and carry away the TV – will take their women into our Ashrams ! That mindset is gathering support.

    When you are strong, people respect you. Pakistan is internally collapsing; so that has emboldened RSS to cross all limits. So, if there is not that power, create that power. If Pakistan is not working (as of now – for whatever reasons – maybe a million reasons); to realise economies of Scale, i wish Pakistan (and Bangladesh) join China. They can pray in their mosques., but they must adopt Chinese ethics of HARD WORK and paying taxes and becoming law-abiding.

    A muslim must obey the law of the land. That is the cardinal principle… but people are playing with Islam to grab power. Same game is going on in India. India survives because of its CHAOS. The Hindus are an intelligent nation – and they move one step forward and 2 steps backward. They are slowly bringing RSS into power. From Nehru to Advani via. Indira Gandhi and Narasimha Rao. It has been a story of a slow and steady climb… very sleazy… very under-hand… very sinister… very silent… A velvet glove that has a bomb inside it.

    Muslims (world-wide) are innocent (bhola-bhala). They must change that – and remove that flaw. If they dont become “smart”, they would be enslaved… and their resources would be stolen / grabbed / occupied / taken-over.

    Pakistan / 53 M-Bastis/Colonies/Countries/ whatever do not realise the importance of SOFT power. They must develop both hard-power and soft-power. They have neither… so how can you expect… what do you expect.

    A small boy, un-armed, innocent, vulnerable… with a box of raw-diamonds is sitting on the foot-path. What do you expect. Someone evil will come., beat the boy, or even kill him., take the box of raw diamonds and flee. Dont remain vulnerable if you want to get respected. Get smart. Put your own house in order. Dont live off rents from bases. Understand the difference between running a Country and a Shadi-Khana. Have a 300-year old (forward) world vision. Dont think in the “Chalo” very casual matriculate-mode.

    As regards RSS… it must be exposed in Paris. No point shouting against it in Pakistan or Bangladesh. They are poor and weak societies grappling with their own survival… RSS as the world’s largest terrorist organisation – this must be highlighted to 100 super-minds in Paris. RSS (Varun/Modi / Bal) must be exposed in Paris.

    Jai Ho…

  12. lal

    An article on ‘the zeal of a convert’ by Daniel Benjamin in Brookings…
    Much as this June’s failed terrorist attacks in London and Glasgow focused attention on the participation of doctors and other professionals in jihadist terror, the plot disrupted in Germany this week seems certain to put the spotlight on another key group within violent Islamism: converts.
    We don’t know much thus far about Fritz Gelowicz or Daniel Martin Schneider, the two German converts who were apprehended earlier this week along with Adem Yilmaz, who has been identified as a Turk. Another seven conspirators, about whom very little has been released, are also being hunted. But the hundreds of gallons of concentrated hydrogen peroxide—useful for bomb-building—they acquired, and the fact that, according to German officials, they had managed to train with the pros in Pakistan suggest that these operatives were, as one U.S. official put it, “the real deal.”

    That may surprise people who have viewed the converts as being the oddest of the oddballs inside al-Qaida’s big tent. There have been grounds for such thinking: Among the most famous are Richard Reid, the oafish would-be shoe bomber, and Jose Padilla, the former fast-food chicken flipper whose ability to construct a dirty bomb, as touted by former Attorney General John Ashcroft, was never proved. But to write them all off as misguided dullards would be a mistake. That there are so many of them tells us something important about the movement, because some are highly competent and have real operational advantages compared with other radicals.

    Their numbers are indeed astonishing. Converts have been involved in jihadist activity since before al-Qaida was fully formed. The “TERRSTOP” conspiracy to blow up landmarks and tunnels in New York City in the mid-1990s included two converts, Clement Hampton-El, an African-American who had been to Afghanistan, and Victor Alvarez, a dimwitted janitor turned gofer for the cell. (Though that conspiracy landed the “Blind Sheikh,” Omar Abdel Rahman, in jail, a connection to al-Qaida was never asserted.) In Osama Bin Laden’s empire, converts have always been well-represented. Wadih el-Hage, the Saudi’s personal assistant and, later, the architect of the East Africa cells that carried out the 1998 embassy bombings, came from a Lebanese Maronite family. The American Taliban, John Walker Lindh, certainly had no problems being accepted in al-Qaida circles. More recently, Californian Adam Gadahn, aka Adam Pearlman, aka Azzam the American, has become a blogosphere celebrity as the English-language voice of al-Qaida.

    Well before the German bust, converts were turning up regularly in European terrorist operations. In the 1990s, several French converts, including brothers David and Jerome Courtailler, fought in Bosnia and later turned up in jihadist activities. A German, Christian Ganczarski, became a significant al-Qaida operative and was linked to a 2002 bombing on the Tunisian island of Djerba. The Walters brothers, Jason and Jermaine, sons of a U.S. serviceman and Dutch mother, were members of the Hofstad gang, which included Mohammed Bouyeri, the Dutch-Moroccan assassin of film director Theo van Gogh in 2004. Jamaican-born, English-raised Germaine Lindsay was one of the four members of the cell that carried out the Tube attacks in London in 2005. In November 2005, Muriel Degauque, a 38-year-old Belgian baker’s assistant and former Catholic, became the first female Muslim suicide bomber from Europe when she attacked a U.S. patrol in Iraq, wounding one soldier.

    If that list doesn’t suffice to make the case that radical converts represent a real danger, the example of Dhiren Barot, an Indian-born British-raised convert from Hinduism known as Issa al-Hindi, ought to clinch it. Barot carried out the surveillance of the New York Stock Exchange and the Citigroup Building in New York City and the International Monetary Fund in Washington, D.C. Intelligence officers I spoke with described the reams of material he supplied as some of the highest-quality work they had ever seen. Barot, fortunately, is now serving a 30-year sentence in a British jail.

    One might have thought that terrorist organizations would be leery of converts and worry that they were unreliable or even suspect them to be moles. The opposite has been true. According to French sociologist Olivier Roy, 10 percent of al-Qaida’s soldiers in the global jihad are converts, and in France the number might reach 25 percent. Roy takes this as an indicator of the group’s globalized nature, “because a convert is not motivated by his or her culture at all. He is not motivated by the political life of his or her country. He’s motivated by joining something global. Al-Qaida is made of born again [Muslims] and converts who join the global jihad. One day they go to Bosnia and another to Chechnya, or to Kashmir, or to Afghanistan, or to Fallujah.”

    Moreover, the phenomenon of conversion plays an important part in al-Qaida’s cosmology. When the group’s propagandists talk about its ultimate victory, the conversion of the Christian West is often mentioned as a major milestone. When the organization wants to show it is on a roll, it also may refer to the current growth in conversions. In a video that aired on Dec. 13, 2001, Bin Laden claimed that the 9/11 attacks had been “understood by both Arabs and non-Arabs. ? In Holland, at one of the centers, the number of people who accepted Islam during the days that follow the operations were more than the people who accepted Islam in the last 11 years.” Bin Laden also relayed a report he had heard regarding an Islamic educator in America who claimed, “We don’t have time to keep up with the demands of those who are asking about Islamic books to learn about Islam.” Having so many converts in its ranks is clearly a mark of achievement.

    Bin Laden’s boasts of mass conversions are mostly bluster. But while good data is hard to come by, scholars and clerics suggest that the numbers are up significantly in the United States and Europe. According to a German government study cited in Der Spiegel, between mid-2004 and mid-2005, 4,000 Germans converted to Islam—about 13 times the rate just three years earlier. A sociologist quoted in the article says some see conversion to Islam as a dramatic act that makes them “stand out from the crowd.” Though negligible in the larger scheme of things, the chance that a convert will turn jihadist is much greater than that of someone born Muslim. That suggests that for those who turn violent, the act is more a matter of standing against the crowd rather than standing out from it. Radical Islamism seems to have become the magnet for some of the world’s angriest people who feel the universe is out of joint and must be changed. For these converts, it is an ideology of revolt that is more attractive because of its crystalline hatred of the status quo than its theology.

    The “zeal of the convert” may be a cliché, but it is a true one that helps explain the presence of so many former non-Muslims in jihadist terror—and why terrorist leaders find them so useful. Another reason is that whether they have formal profiling programs or not, Western law-enforcement officials are inevitably going to be less likely to suspect someone who looks like one of their own. (Fortunately for the Germans, Fritz Gelowicz had distinguished himself as a radical years ago and had run-ins with the law.) Abu Musab al-Zarqawi understood this and called for the creation an army of “white-skinned” mujahideen. It appears that may be happening without any help from the Iraqi jihad’s dead emir.

  13. NRI: Aap bh khush rahiye
    Indian: Your arguments do not make any sense other than a blind instinct to prove India’s greatness and think of Pakistan as some sort of Taliban state. have you ever visited Pakistan? I bet you haven’t and base your whole diatribe on what is printed in Indian media. We have Xmas holidays too –
    Do you know the state of Indian Muslims. Read SACHAR committee report authored by Indians themselves and it is a public document. Its data and narration speaks of victimisation, neglect and discrimination as far as the largest minority is concerned. Get your facts right before taking wild shots.

    Sista: You are absolutely right on dogmas.

    Som: Sorry, the argument that in a ‘democracy’ hate speech is permissible does not fly. Your line baffled me:
    “You got to understand that in a democracy, you just can’t muzzle someone because you fear he might say something which amounts to bigotry.”
    Sorry I don’t understand – it is not amounting to bigotry – it is a call for violence, chopping hands and elimination/cleansing agenda – very much like Modi and Thackrey.

  14. Milind Kher

    Modi’s effectiveness as an administrator or economist cannot be used to condone his brutal behavior as a leader.

    Also, Varun Gandhi’s hate speech cannot be dismissed as “immature prattle”.

    There is a very frightening talibanization happening inside India. At least, the Taliban can attempt to lay some claim to an ideology, the saffron brigade can lay claim to none.

    Else, it is the same in both countries, an entire administration with all the military at its command is unable to rein in the extremists.

  15. Indian dude

    @M R Lakhanie writes:

    “””Pakistan, even though is a muslim country, provides utmost rights to its minority civilians and are an asset to the country.”””

    1>Pak constitution point 41(2) really gives “utmost rights to its minority civilians and are an asset to the country”……lol.

    2> What did u guys do to a certain Dr.Abdus salam…..”First———Nobel Prize Winner”

    3>what about the ahmadis ??how many of them are killed daily??

    4>What about Shias??their mosques gets blown up every week???

    You say Christmas is a holiday in Pakistan………for your information it is ALSO a holiday in India….indian schools and colleges get almost TWO WEEKS of christmas holiday.

    For your info, Govt. of India gives SUBSIDIES to haj pilgrims…….govt. of Pak overcharges them!!

  16. Indian dude

    @M R Lakhanie

    Few more for morons like you

    Aligarh Muslim University, Jamia Milia Islamia Univ has 50% seats RESERVED for muslims.

    Aligarh Univ’s annual govt. grant is 245 Crores ruppees(( IIT’s annual grant is about 80 crores)).

  17. Indian dude- An Interesting FACT

    In south kolkata, their is a constituency where more than 90% ARE HINDUS……..

    What so special about it??

    A certain Suman Chakraborty is contesting from that place on a ticket by Congress and is EXPECTED TO WIN.

    Again what so special about it??

    He just CONVERTED TO ISLAM……….and is still expected to WIN from a constituency with more than 90% HINDU POPULATION!!!!

    @@@@@@@@@@@@

    Any possibility of a Muslim converted to other religions winning from anywhere in Pakistan??

  18. Amit

    Be scared you pakis , we are coming for you !! For long have you people supported all sorts of madmen who have killed people in India in the name of religion , to be precise since early 80’s . First Khalistan , then Kashmir and Now the attack on Mumbai !! now the same thing will become your bane !! Be scared , really scared !!

  19. Indian dude

    However whatever Varun said needs to be CONDEMNED in the strongest possible terms……no excuses here.

  20. nri2

    We need posts like these to make india better. Thanks for the free services.

  21. Amit – your comment hs nothing to do with the subject. Don’t visit this site if you have such venom against Pakistan.
    NRI-2: Are you being sarcastic. if yes, then it was a terrible attempt
    R

  22. lal

    flash news……..varun bared from from contesting elections…criminal proceedings to be started……that shud satisfy all.cheers india

  23. lennonismrulz

    pakistani from London: Bombay has too many potholes
    Indian from NY: Don’t get me started on the garbage dumps in Karachi
    Pakistani From London: Atleast we dont have Asia’s largest slum

    wow another round of india pakistan! … it surprises me that there is so much to hate in the world but so little to like…

    talking about scary names varun’s full name is feroze varun gandhi. wonder what does he have to say about his muslim-sounding persian first name..
    dont worry varun won’t come to power and so wouldn’t modi… the ambanis don’t elect governments, people do…. modi is the CM in gujarat only because congress is hopeless for everybody.. atleast modi promises “development” for some communities…

    it also surprises me that when politicians ask people to pay their taxes no one gives a damn… but when they ask to kill people… we come out in hundreds… varun gandhi or modi don’t kill people, people do … the sweet taste of haemoglobin

  24. NRI

    uff I wanted to write here’s to kickstart the comments riot cheers (one alphabet can make a lot of difference) anyways ……..After I started my career my first boss was a Sikh the next belonged to the majority community, the next again a Sikh the next one a Christian Goan probably, the next a Jain (many Jains like to differ Jainism from Hinduism) the next a Jew my partner has had the privilege of working under a Bohra Muslim (don’t know even if they are recognised as Muslim given the state of Ahmedis in Pakistan like I read on a new comment to a blogpost ‘Chronicles foretold’ at PTH these were ordinary middle class people not very big names and yes two of these were women. Do you know Bhai Mohan Singh founder of Ranbaxy Pharma is a Sikh a Sardarji as we say, Azim Premji founder Wipro is a Gujarati muslim, JRD Tata and Adi Godrej of course Parsis, when I moved from Delhi to Pune not knowing the local language I used to be a mute spectator in Ganesh Chaturthi poojas (prayer assembly) I was surprised to see my muslim collegue don the Marathi prayer cap and lead the group with a loud recitation of Jaidev jaidev jai mangal murti darshan matre man kamna purti..with the pooja plate and flame in hand, well each day a different office member would lead the prayer ceremony before the 10 day festival culminated these are not few in between examples we in India be it arts, journalism, army, science, business, politics, bollywood, medicine, law we are used to seeing our minorities stand and sit along with us on the same platform since childhood I had two christian friends in my school gang and the feeling that they were any different or less than the other 4 of us never came to our minds I wonder if this is the case in Pakistan and if so where are its pakistani christian, muslim, parsi painters, writers, sportsmen ? how can anybody say Pakistan VALUES its minorities or that Pak constitution point really gives “utmost rights to its minority civilians and are an asset to the country” how come its minorities have dwindled so pathetically and drastically and India’s are flourishing so rapidly and boisterously ?

    All said and done this is a good post Indians of all caste, creed and colour need to strive to make India a better place we are glad we have neighbours to remind us its importance. *Yawn* too late to check typos now.

  25. Harry

    It is good for Pakistanis to be smug about Varun Gandhi. Afterall they have already done to non-Muslims, what Varun says he will do to Muslims.

    One have to remember that prior to Partition more than 30% of population of present day Pakistan was non-Muslim. today one has to send a search party to find a Hindu or a Sikh in Pakistan.

    What Pakistanis are doing is like a Cat, after eating 100 rats, going to hajj and start claiming holy.

    You should count your stars that ruling class of India is so stupid that you can practically get away with anything. Zia ul Haq, Benazir Bhutto, Nawaz shariff in past had outsmarted Indian leaders and Zardari will do too.

  26. aloku

    YLH pls allow the link to be uploaded. Kindly do this as a favour to me having participated in your blog for too long. We may have our differences but you need to help me on this.

  27. aloku

    thanks YLH and RAZA

    Indian friends you can visit indiateahouse.wordpress.com

    pakistani friends are most welcome to air their views

  28. ambarish

    what was the hindu population in 1947 and what is the population now interms of %. how many heads of state are from minority in pakistan. why is it pakistan is a islamic republic. hindu vedic chats can be heard in US congress but not in india parliament.where every thing abt pak institutions is abt quran. whole word knows what is happening to pakistan.what it stands for.

  29. Yayati Tapale

    If you look at the recent unforgivablw activities of Pakistanis and their govt. I feel any govt. who comes in power in India should take on Pakistan hand on hand. It is the time for Pak to learn lesson for their cowerdly acts.

  30. sathish

    I just do not know why everyone is so scared about the varun gandhi statement. it seems that pakistanis had forget all the sins they are commited. They are the persons who have killed 1000of hindus in the name of religion, and no one could question them. raza ruzmi have no idea of india and its secular qualities. ruzmi was just mentioning a gujarat riots, but she should also remember it is the same country where 10000 or more people were killed by islamic radicals. Secular does not mean that ignore the crime commited by minorities.

  31. Dastagir

    India has every right to remain Nehruvian or to bury it and opt for Modi-ism. But Nehruvian secularism served India good. Let us see what Modi-ism will do., 60 yrs from now.

    Varun is asking Hindus to consolidate ! “Sab Hindu ek taraf ho jaaaaao!” Kyoun ? Get prepared for Civil War. This is the real threat.

    BJP/RSS have planned and scheduled the “Schedule of Bombings / Riots / Carnage” that will be executed just before Elections ! Indian people are emotional and elections are fought on “emotions”. Use Raw emotions. Jai Shri Ram. We will protect Hindu Girls from Muslim Goons. We will give you the power to rape / burn / loot Muslims with impunity. We will give you the empowered feeling of a safforn “Viagra”. Jai Shri Ram. Hate is a best-seller like violence, cuz it brings in quick results. It takes lot of time to build – but very little to destroy. It takes 25 years for a tree to grow… but 25 minutes to cut it. BJP is offering cutting / burning / looting / raping / destroying as an Option.. .as a sport… and on this hatred and fake “Viagra”., it wants to build a Hindu Society or Samaaj.

    Using Muslim blood and tears as water to knead the Hindu Cement. i.e.

    Whether the Indian electorate falls for such cheap gimmicks… or see-thru the games… we will know it after 2 montsh. Education need not necessarily mean wisdom and humane-ness. Those who burnt / raped / killed in Gujrat 2002 and Mumbai 1992.. were technically “educated” men !

    All of this is unfortunately leading to a scenario of Civil War. Very unfortunate… but this road leads to that goal.

    If Civil War is what BJP wants to build India upon, then i am afraid, development, investment and all., will have to be put on the back-burner for atleast a century.

    Which foreign investor / company will invest his money (in today’s recessionary times) in a country on the verge of a Civil War. BJP (which is setting the polity of the country now., with a weak Congress that is losing ground by the day… not because its ideals are wrong… but because it is not TRUE to its ideals). All political parties enter into elections basically to win. There are people who have invested money in the process and want it back… So when push comes to shove, ideology is put on the back-burner. This is the unfortunate aspect of democracy.

    By supporting Varun, BJP is signalling that it wants to build an India as expounded by Varun very openly. If the Indian people want a civil war., if they elect BJP., that should be accepted as the voice of the indian people. English Press cannot hide that ugly reality… However, for every action there is a reaction. Of course there will be a economic cost for Varun’s India.

    Progress has to be forgotten. If Indian electorate prefers riots / violence / rape (cuz it is adventurous and exciting, you know.. fake sense of empowerment.. feeling victor.. fake Safforn Viagra Ride); over development / peace and social harmony… in the short term, they may enjoy playing “Victor” over the vanquished., but that joy will be short-lived.

  32. Mandar Umrani

    It is, indeed, a very great thing that Raza Rumi has written about the comments of Varun Gandhi and expressed his/her opinions about this Nation called India. Expressing opinions is always better than despatching batches of terrorists to eliminate the innocents in India.

    There are few Hindutvavadi’s in India who have dented the image of this Nation. The likes of Modi, Advani, Thakrey, Uma Bharti and many from the safron brigade have made immense damage to this Nation. There is enough fear created in the minds of Muslims & Christians living in India. The killings of Muslims in Gujarat or the killings of Christians in Orissa with state support speaks volumes of the BJP ruled states. Before Babri demolition, the minorities had rarely remembered that they are minorities. Now the situation has worsened. To bring themselves in limelight, this new found method of creating hatred against minorities is widely used, mainly by the thugs of Saffron Brigade. We, in India, keep on hoping that India be not turned into Hindu Taliban.

  33. JWMarriot

    Hey,
    I am happy for Varun. Here’s one youngster among large spineless Indian politician family. Asking Hindus to become one does not incite communal hatred. He is simply asking the Hindus to vote for him. If other political parties go after Muslims for votes, what is wrong in requesting for Hindu votes. Hindus in India have become minority in many respects, trying to please Muslims for their votes. Hindus are being targetted as communal for believing in their faith., whereas Muslims even after all the atrocity committed by them go scot free.
    India is a strong economy, which is thriving on all fronts due to its peaceful existence among all communities. But alas, it has to change due to politicians.

  34. Manzoor

    @ Indian
    Your comments show your bias towards Pakistan. Those who trying to paint the Varun Ghandi comments as harangues to get electoral mileage are mistaken, as the roots of the bigotry goes too deep in India, even Ghandi Ji was assassinated by a RSS fanatic, whose agenda is now being spearheaded by the BJP, of which your singing praises.
    Secondly, the Tamil insurgency, one of the bloodiest conflicts in South Asia also traces its roots to your abode of secularism and love. All know that the Gujarat pogroms, and Babri Mosque, Godhra incident and Samjhota Express attack all have been planned and carried out by Pakistani Jihadis.
    The most glaring example of your secularism and democracy are Indian Muslims; those who ruled India for 600 years are now demanding jobs quota to be at par with Dalits, if not sure consult Sachar Commission report.

  35. JWMarriot

    Raza Rumi,
    You have to take criticism with a pinch of salt. Dont think that you are a know all and an authority of Indian system.
    We are above all Pakis in every respect and all spheres of life…except………TERRORISM!!!

  36. JWMarriot

    Manzoor,
    We were ruled by Muslims for 600 years as we were physically weak, and wars were mostly fought with raw physical power. Those days are history my friend.
    Today, wars are fought in the drawing room with brains. India is a huge economy with immense brain power across the world and with a booming economy. Every country in the world is envious of India for this.
    Of course, we want every citizen to live with a common civil code.

  37. india superpower 2040

    india is a good country and much better than pakistan. i am a brahmin who wears the janeu and follow the strictest rules of modern hinduism (which does not include any hint of casteism).What modi did was wrong, as a kid i wrote a poem about guj riot in my high school magazine. a silly poem ,my first poem. MODI SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN JAIL OR SHOULD HAVE BEEN ASSASSINATED. he is not in jail. he is dreaming 6to become the pradhan mantri. I HANG MY HEAD IN SHAME. PLAIN SHAME…—…a hindu

  38. lal

    raza,sorry for the mess….u myt have heard the news that bjp has a set of paid bloggers whose take turns to comment in various websites 24×7…they usually come in a swarm like this…i was wondering y they never discovered this hide out….well , to be fair to bjp,it is a brilliant concept…if u didnt kno something like this existed,u vl feel the whole new young generation of indians are with bjp….

  39. Harry

    india superpower 2040 shows thuggish behaviour of Nehru secularist power grabbers. They would want to assasinate anybody who does not agree with their vision.

    They have particular dislike for all Gujaratis, irrespective of being Hindu or Muslim. This goes to pre-independence day, when Nehru had to face Gujaratis like Gandhi, Patel and Jinnah. He manipulated them to fight among themselves, otherwise Jinnah would have become first Prime Minister of united India.

  40. Som

    Raza, I’m still at my wit’s end. Unless you allow someone to speak, how’d you know the content of his speech! Or you propose gagging people?

  41. vollmond

    JWMarriot: “We were ruled by Muslims for 600 years as we were physically weak, and wars were mostly fought with raw physical power. Those days are history my friend.”

    JWMarriot, Very well said but mistaken on the issue of ‘physical strength’. It was idealism and humanitarianism that brought us down in history and allowed centuries of Islamic colonialism in India, not the lack of physical strength. It was a huge mistake by Prithviraj Chauhan to let go Mohammad Gori free instead of executing him spot on when he was captured. But no more mistakes now onwards; I might not agree with the way Varun said few things but there is an underlying truth in what he said; and it is painful to see that some so-called Indians here are begging for pardon and pouring out their apologies, shame on these traitors. But still much worse is for some others to bad-mouth Nehru on this Pakistani forum. I hope Indians can get some senses and remain singularly strong, BJP or Congress we need to remain a united force. Cheers

  42. aliarqam

    Extracts from Sherry’s blog….Nehru’s grandson Varun Gandhi , other day spoke in a language against Muslims which shamed the legacy of his grandfather and Mahatma Gandhi. Varun Gandhi has a blood relation with Nehru but his politics has nothing to do with the legacy of Mahatama Gandhi or Jawahurlal Nehru. Mr Varun Gandhi took the line which was the line of Indian communalists before partition against which Nehru and Gandhi stood. Varun Gandhi is not in Congress but the BJP. The heir of Hindu communalism ,which existed before partition who were the real authors of “Two Nation theory”.The Hindu and Muslim communalists which are now called “Hindu and Muslim Nationalists” fashionably , are the cause of religious hatred in India and Pakistan. Varun Gandhi was yet another voice of Religious Nationalism which is “segregationist” and “separatist”. It resulted in breaking of India and the never ending conflict which plagues Indian subcontinent. War, Taliban and Nuclear proliferation are a few expressions of the evil which religious nationalism produced. Varun Gandhi mocked philosophy of Mahatama Gandhi in his speech and departed from Nehru’s secular vision. The Indian Liberal’s continuous attack on Gandhi and Nehru has resulted in slow erosion of secular-socialist values which has resulted in rise of BJP and communalism in India. Just as their muslim counterpart Pakistani liberals are bringing PML-N and Jamate Islami on their shoulders to throne of Islamabad. Time has come that people revisit the history and rediscover the evil of religious nationalism which now threat 3 states. India, Pakistan and Bangladesh. Following is an article sent to me by a friend JZ written a veteran Pakistani Leftist and Prof Kurt Jacobsen both of them also co-authored number of books and frequently write for prestigious publications like The Harvard International Review and Le Monde Diplomatique it speaks about legacy of Gandhi and gives a very balanced view of Gandhi , Jinnah and others. We must stop the evil of communalism and religious nationalism weather it exist in fascist form , ie Taliban and RSS or its liberal-secular form the BJP and Pakistan Muslim League and their representatives like Varun Gandhi

  43. aliarqam

    sherryx.wordpress.com

  44. yasserlatifhamdani

    Aliarqam,

    Shaheryar Ali is still smarting from being absolutely wrong on the Chief Justice issue…

    These pathetic attempts by Shaheryar Ali to use inverted illogic…. the first contingent of the PML-N to make it into the federal capital was led by its foremost christian MP. PML-N might be center right …. but how he can equate PML-N at the moment to BJP or to Varun Gandhi is just hogwash.

    While the entire Pakistani people – from all walks of life and all points of view came together around one point and stood together in a secular democratic movement for constitutional rights… people like Shaheryar Ali are merely trying to lessen the blow that has been hit to those who want to keep us backward… lest Pakistan becomes a progressive constitutional society based on rule of law.

    There is a term that Fraz Shafique put up in his article below… I won’t repeat it here…. but spot on.

  45. Milind Kher

    Liberal and secular forces have major forces to battle.

    Pakistan has the Taliban and terrorist organizations like the LeT and JeM.

    India has various groups that form the saffron brigade.

    These are both bent upon pushing their respective nations to the brink of war with each other. That is what we all have to guard against.

  46. JWMarriott: I am not averse to criticism. Not at all.
    Wise old man: You are neither ‘wise’ nor transparent as you leaving bigoted comments under cover. Therefore, I see no need to respond to you.

    Som: No, I don’t propose gagging of anyone. But hate speech is not permissible especially in world’s largest democracy and a haven of secularism as some of the commentors above have tried to prove in their jingoistic and sometimes senseless comments.

  47. Milind: thanks for your intervention – this is my fear too and hence the above post. It is not about India-Pakistan point scoring nor Hindu-Muslim debate but an issue of our future. We as South Asians should oppose extremism everywhere – India or Pakistan.

  48. Shahzad

    Well said Raza.

  49. vinay

    hi
    whats the point in demonising varun gandhi….if nehru is to live till this time he would have cetainly concurred with varun and vallabhai patel…… to hell with this islamic fundamentalism and these dirty fanatics…..india is certainly a great country where in minorities r given equal rights , not equal much more like reservations etc……but these demons , dont understand humanrights, behead people who dont believe their god, kill women in the name of modesty, treat “em like satans, and dont understand the human right to exist and freedom of religion. in the muslim world they dont accept democratic and secular values , but where they r in minority they exploit it.they use the lenience to plant bombs , massacre people and last but not the least defend kiling of people in the name of allah and quran…i do believe partition of indian subcontinent was correct and partial with equal number of these silly bastards staying back in india…….its a mistake on part of gandhi and nehru not to fore see this green venom…….

  50. M R Lakhanie

    Am glad the responses here reached sanity. We could spend hours and hours on threatning and intimidating each other and hurling accusations *read Be scared you pakis , we are coming for you*. We, the majority of the Pakistani nation would like to see friendly, neighourly, cordial relations with India. But friendly relations not on the cost of Kashmir, not on the cost of inequality between the two countries and not on the cost of bypassing the two nation theory. People in India need to understand that Pakistan is now a reality and we are here to stay! As much cordial relations we want with India, we are still not one … we were never one and this is exactly what we cherish on the 23rd of March when the Resolution of Pakistan was passed by the All India Muslim League.
    Yes our troops are eyeball to eyeball at the borders but we need to acknowledge the fact that our real enemy is poverty that pushes a huge chunk of our both population below the poverty line. Our common enemy is extremism, Taleban on this side and the Saffron-brigade on the other. Our common enemy is illetracy.

  51. Shahzad

    Vinay,

    By saying “whats the point in demonising varun gandhi….if nehru is to live till this time he would have cetainly concurred with varun and vallabhai patel” you have demonstrated that you are as ignorant as the Taliban and RSS.

    While many Pakistanis have qualms about Nehru over some of his actions, it is fair to say he was a gentleman and not a hate monger. For you to claim otherwise is distortion of history and is utterly despicable.

  52. Krishna

    World is very big.We are accusing each other like frog in the well.this all politics.not necessarily break heads to comment on it.developements come from good governess.there are lots of loop hole in india and pakistan systems.of course pakistan have more breakers of system because of religion sentiments.we have to progress hand in hand as good neighbours.if one neighbour sprink bad smell i will affect everybody including one who spills.that is true in many cases.tolerence is main.openly saying in muslim countries that is vey megre.they dont allow other faiths to be their own freely.you guys allow others to convert in to muslim but not vice versa.this just one example.In india everybody knows how muslims come.was there any muslims 1000 years before.so be realistic.just becasue of one two peopel dont judge indias integrity regarding religion.muslim rulers done lot damage to indian culture and temples.but just un-used one masid they started destroing india being indian muslims.what a great.dont be fenatic.let us go together.strive to come up.by puting both of us fight,china enjoying fruits.

  53. Abdur Rehman

    Mr. Varun Gandhi : Marta kya na karta …
    When Varun’s aggressive communal speech has crossed the border, it will be interesting for the readers on the other side of the border to know the facts why Varun said what he did…
    Pilibhit was Varun’s mother Maneka Gandhi’s constituency for five terms. Being the Sikh origin she used to win with large support of Punjabi/Sikh population in an area that borders the Terai region of Nepal. Now that assembly segment has shifted to neighbouring Shahjahanpur with the Muslim dominated area Nawabganj which has become the part of Pilibhit constituency…
    His opponent Riyaz Ahmed is the four term legislator from the area and an old confidant of his mother who won the first assembly election in 1983 on the ticket of Sanjay Vichar manch- a party floated by Maneka Gandhi using her late husband’s name. Now Riyaz Ahmed is Samajwadi Party candidate- the party floated by Mulayam Singh- known for his pro Muslims overtures and Ex-Chief minister of U.P…
    Other opponent is V.M. Singh, cousin of Maneka Gandhi on Congress ticket. They have property disputes and Singh is determined to ensure that Varun loses the election…
    These are the odds the first time aspirant for the Lok Sabha seat, Varun Gandhi, is facing on BJP ticket…
    With Muslims constituting the third of the voting population, Varun seems to have been fallen back on the tactic of of his sinking party BJP to polarise the Hindu sentiments, the Hindu politics of 1990s, to create a communal divide and consolidate the Hindu votes on his side…
    This is politics and it should be looked from that angle only: Marte, kya na karte…(Varun & BJP)
    The Law of India is strong enough to punish them.

  54. Dastagir

    Speaking truth is not spreading hatred. Speaking the truth is beyond the political map (lines on paper). Speaking the truth is beyond “Nationalism” in the technical sense. Humanism is beyond Nationalism., and must always remain so.

    Internal Matter : A matter remains internal as long as it is within limits. When a threshold of decency is crossed., there is a knock on the door … If there is more shouting in the house, the door is pushed open. Internal becomes External. For every action, there is an equal reaction., as Narendra Modi wonderfully reminded us in 2002. The comic part is : That he both planned and executed the “action”, and also the “reaction”.

    Varun Gandhi is not the issue. Its the symptom. The sin. There will be people like him, who will use abusive language. Point is: They should be within the margins… not main-stream. If BJP/RSS are winning (running 11 Provinces); that means something is wrong with the mindset of Indians themselves.

    Hate is a best-seller in India., and Islam/Muslims are the easiest (soft) target… During the past 60 years, India has also progressed.. so there is a new sense of personality and identity. Like a young person wanting to assert (nayee jawani); this nation which is experiencing a sense of entitlement and empowerment (which it did not experience before); wants to prove its superiority. For that you need a victim. The weakest segment of society is the easiest victim to target… and feed the ego. Sadistic element is getting mixed here with a sense of personality and achievement and identity (if you take it at the highest level).

    RSS wants to establish the Hindu Identity and personality and ego., transforming the innate character of Hinduism… by giving it a violent flavour in the name of Hindutva. In simple words, they want to convert Hindus to Judaism… or Anarchy-ism… with some idols and symbols thrown in to provide a “setting”. This is a betrayal of Hinduism itself (in the long run)… but who cares.

    Its an age of Fast food (Fast food ka zamana hai. Fast results chaahiye. Indulge in hate speech / plan and execute carnage / riots before elections / divide society / and romp to victory… masses are fools). I am afraid, at this very moment, RSS is planning the schedule of executing Hindu-Muslim riots in India., just before the Elections… or even After Elections as Varun openly said… Maybe because of his youth, he blurted out.

    KATUA : The muslims like jews go for circumcision of the boys., for hygenic reasons. There is a slang for it “Katua”.. i.e. the one who has been cut. It means the circumcised male… (a slang used for muslims i.e.). I am reminded of Manto’s short story : “Mishtake” as i write this. Anyways…

    Sanjay Gandhi himself was a “Katua”. Mohammed Younus had got him circumcised. (Why he circumcised the son of Indira and Feroze Ratan Gandhi ? Ask Khushwant Singh !). Varun Gandhi must ask his mother Menaka (get it confirmed from her) whether his father Sanjay was also a “Katua”. She is the right person to confirm / deny it. Is this reality “doctored” too, Varun ?

    Varun is the sinner… “hatred” is the sin. Indian society is adopting a rough / crude / vulgar / abusive character. In speach and action, people are so agressive… fighting over very minor things. Culture /decency / dignity / Maryada / Aqlaaq are a thing of the past.

    Varun must ask (get it confirmed from his mother Menaka) whether his father Sanjay used to slap / beat his mother Indira ? What was it., that Sanjay blackmailed his mother Indira with…..

    Varun must ask his mother Menaka Gandhi (confirmation), what the nature of her relation was with Mr. Akbar Ahmed, 25-30 years back… I hope he hates names like “Akbar.. and Ahmed” too. Its his choice. Is Varun the son of Sanjay or Akbar Ahmed Dumpy ? Get Varun’s DNA Test done… along with the forensic of the CD (which has already been done by the EC at the Forensic Lag in Agra).

    Varun must ask his mother (get it confirmed) why she was married to Sanjay in the house of Mr. Mohammed Younus. Who was Younus… was he Varun’s Daada ? (Ask Khushwant Singh). Was RSS Headquarters Premises not available for the marriage ?

    Maybe these are rumours… that Varun’s daada (paternal grandfather) was Mohammed Younus who was a Pakhtoon.. that his father is (was) Akbar Ahmed Dumpy… that his official father Sanjay (Sanjeev) Gandhi was a “Katua”… He should confirm all these things with his mother., whether these are “Truths” or “Doctored views”.

    There are many stories.. .Sanjay (Sanjeev)’s Passport story in London… why he had to take a new passport… the theft he committed in London.. Who was the Indian Commissioner then.. who issued a new (emergency) passport… How he was packed off from London… What were the circumstances in which he was hushed off from London ?

    Why Sanjay stayed with Bal Thackerey on his visits to Bombay (now Mumbai). The “orgies” that happened in Mumbai… There are still people alive. Ask Hema Malini… Ask Latabai Mangeshkar… what he ordered…

    Purani Files Khulne chaahiye. (“Khol Dalo” – a short story by Manto).

    Emergency (1975-77) File must be RE-OPENED… for us to refresh our memories.

    Kya Varun KATUA + CHOR ka beta hai ? Hayn..

    Menaka should answer Varun with Truths. She must not “Cut” (Katua) the truths.. and doctor them. Varun must know the truths.

    Jai Ho.

  55. Al

    What’s up guys?….. Why r we all talking to these dirty Taliban & Al qaida influenced poor Pakistanis. We all know, if we throw a stone in mud, eventually we only are going to get dirty.

    Whole world knows very well what is Pakistan about & how are they gettin their bread from. Only religon they follow is Terrorism! Only work they have is putting spanners in every countries process…& they have very much affection towards India… they think of India…they feel about India….they dream about India…but alas.. all bad things.. hence they are not able to concentrate on their own bussiness… well.. sorry .. their whole business is to disturb India…!!!!

    Regarding Varun, I would say.. Pakis have no right to talk about this… he is such a baby in Indian politics…….

    No need to prove any point to these blind folded minds of Talibanistanis…. sorry… Pakistanis…. But It will not be too far to change that name to Talibanistan.

  56. Bharat

    copy paste learnt from Dustageer

    Yesterday TATA NANO was on the top headline in BBC Southeast Asia page 🙂

    yes the moderates become blind when Dust – again dustagir and comes to kick around Dust, raza, ylh, hamdani or watstherename and this so called Milind Kher (must be fake) all become deaf and dumb.

    all India post is a reflection of their hatred for India they want to but these odd incidents to boost the moral of paki bros, why don’t they write about the poor ratio of Christian and Hindu minorities of their own country and posts about Muhajirs ?

    Why don’t they comment or write about the progress in the state of Gujrat …….that would bring them brickbats by guys like dustagain.

  57. Bharat

    I forgot there are a few Sikhs in the land of the Pure also when one poor sikh guy made it to some rank in Army it was BIG news in the Indian Media. Indians are big hearted fools we like to talk about the scant good that happen, once in a blue moon, in the padosi mulk. 🙂

  58. Harry

    We need to see ewverything in prospective.

    India was entirely Hindu or Buddhist. Islam came uninvited, killed millions of Hindus and Buddhists, and destroyed thousands of Hindu and Buddhist temples, shrines and learning institutions, good examples are Somanath and Nalanda. This process continues even today e.g Bamiyan Buddha.

    Secularists Hindus and many Mulims have moral standard of Goebbels. Goebbels claimed allied massacre in East Prussia was barbarism, quite conviniently forgetting mass murders carried out by German SS troops in Slavic countries.

    I think Muslims should apologize Hindus, Buddhists and other Kaffirs for the havoc they brought upon them along the line of Pope for sufferings that Nazis inflicted upon Jews.

    Raza, I will be surprised if you will post this letter and will be even more surprised if give your honest thoughts.

  59. Harry

    In western countries, when one goes to see a presentation by South Asian diplomats, in general one is stuck by the low quality of the presntation, which may reflect the poor quality of education.

    But letters like one by Dastagir reflects the gutterial mind of large number of so called educated persons. They can not paricipate in civilized discussion, in what is called agreeing to disagree.

    I hope that number of such people in South Asia is not very large otherwise South Asia is doomed, as there would be no mechanism for exchange of honest views only propaganda and nasty comments.

    A person should be judged by what he has to offer, not who he is.

  60. joe

    I saw an interesting film in which an african warlord was explaining to a westerner on the carnage that was happenning. He said that this is nation building. A people deciding their fate. This is the only way that it can happen…
    (what i further gathered from it was that finally the victor will establish a democratic system and bring about a fair and transparent government so as to enjoy the fruits of success.) pretty much like the western world. Till then there will be carnage, like animal tribes fighting each other to the finish.

    Reflecting on it i felt that there was some truth. No intelligent person would give in. Even if a few diplomatic gestures are done, the heart and mind still harbours the hatred.

    But the geographic expanse from afganistan to srilanka have a common tribe of humans. A common physical structure with variant strains.

    Can there suddenly be a consensus. A merging of the entire geography. A sealing of the borders beyond that.

    A reduction in defence costs related to manning borders and the same diverted to humanity and of course defence research and technical superiority. There’s more money here than the gdp’s of many countries.

    Would not the un-divided fertile lands of punjab produce at least three times as much. If not the ten times that history watchers regulary lament on.

    Before the rennaisance, this was the world power.
    Give the west their due for the rennaisance. Well now it’s time to take our rightful place back. The greeks had their time, then the egyptians, then the romans, then the brits, now the americans, not to forget the mongols…power keeps passing…

    what would happen if a merger of the entire geography from afgan to lanka happened.

    can we not consider or maybe dream. at least in cyber space.
    joe

  61. barun

    dear raza i think in pakistan is needing you and the cercumstances are very critical like you or other pakies wisers ought to concentrate towards the inner situation plz don’t etrrupt in india we have already toomuch criticized him for this camment…plz pay attention own work. nosooner pak will be slaved by taliban due to your indian anxity…plz we are more than 1.25crocr to think about this………

  62. Chris Hayes

    >#As for the numbers about minorities please don’t pick them out of a hat. Pakistan after partition was a predominantly muslim nation and it’s natural for the minority’s percentage to decrease accordingly with time.
    >
    It is? Where? I was under the impression that in most modern nation states the numbers of minorities are increasing? Unless of course there is a system in place promoting one ideological group over another.

  63. vollmond

    joe: “Before the rennaisance, this was the world power.
    Give the west their due for the rennaisance. Well now it’s time to take our rightful place back. The greeks had their time, then the egyptians, then the romans, then the brits, now the americans, not to forget the mongols…power keeps passing…

    what would happen if a merger of the entire geography from afgan to lanka happened.”

    Right, if you are not imagining a large stretch of ‘Pakistan’ because that’s what Islamists are dreaming of. So first we need to throw the ‘religion of peace’ and its followers out of this whole region [to where they originally came from]. Same we have to do in Europe as well, some rough-and-tough cleaning. This filth [that grew in a pervert bandit’s mind almost 14 hundred years back] has spread too far too fast, while we were all holding on to the principles of morality.

  64. A True India

    India has always considered the Section of its Citizens to be equall and that alone whats called Secularism..

    If Muslims need help whole india wud help.. Unlike Pakistan or newhere in owrld.. The relief funds reach hindu nd other communities equally..

    INDIAN LEADERS have always helped the suffering community from every kind of Problem..

    Currently its Hindus’ who are suffering ..
    And we have our Firm Leader Varun Gandhi with us..

    Hindus’ have never considered Muslims or Islam as another religion.. coz Islam is also based on our Sanātana Dharma.. promoting the good, peace n love.. and if you prove that Islam is not what I am writing then this is proved that Islam is related to terrorism ..

    Hindus’ have supported and will always support every Indian.. without any Religion Bais.. coz they themselves not consider Hinduism as a religion as a group.. its JUST and Only ETERNAL LAW OF UNIVERSE.. obeyed in every other so called religions on Earth..

    The EXTREME that the Truth … that Rāma exists or Not..??? One can question existance of other Gods or Religion but can’t Rāma.. as the so called Adam Bridge actually exist.. exactly in the way mentioned in Rāmāyana.. if still doubt about Rāma.. but 1 thing is true .. Hindu’s are the most Inteeligent and most developed eternally .. that cud see and record the Bridge in those ages..
    which are now seen through Sattelite Cameras.

  65. SV

    What a fool. What else ? Was the Taj Mahal a Siva Temple, and the Kabba a Siva Linga?

    Again, what a fool.

    – A True True Indian.

  66. Milind Kher

    SV,

    It is not the Kaaba that these pseudo historians claim to be a sivalinga. It is the Hajre Aswad.

    Anyway, we all know that the Hajre aswad is actually a meteorite..

  67. vollmond

    A True India: “Hindus’ have never considered Muslims or Islam as another religion.. coz Islam is also based on our Sanātana Dharma.. promoting the good, peace n love.. and if you prove that Islam is not what I am writing then this is proved that Islam is related to terrorism ..”

    As I just mentioned above, Islam is not based on any dharma or thought of benevolence [if there is any it is only for its own kind]. It amazes me to see how ignorant is today’s generation of Indians [especially after reading SV and Milind Kher]. Indeed, you are all ripe once again to be ruled by Islamists if you do not open up your eyes now. Islam is an expansionist socio-political system [exactly like Maoism/Marxism], not a religion, and it openly justifies murder, rape, betrayal and every possible sin you can imagine, in the cause of its expansion – go read Quran, if you haven’t yet! That is to say, if you resort to any kind of idealism against Islam you are destined to be doomed. Learn from your own history and the current day world affairs, and add to it an understanding of instructions to the faithful that Quran stipulates, maybe you’ll gain some wisdom.
    ———-

    Milind Kher: “SV, It is not the Kaaba that these pseudo historians claim to be a sivalinga. It is the Hajre Aswad. Anyway, we all know that the Hajre aswad is actually a meteorite..”

    Mr Milind Kher, for self-asserting “intellectuals” like you, the question is not whether some stone being worshipped by any community is a meteorite or has true mystic relevance but, whether Islam seized these objects of reverence belonging to other religions and claimed to be its own or not. Indeed if you have read history [not the one written by communists], you must know that before beginning of the age of “Prophet” the “mosque” in Mecca was a pagan temple. And I’ll ask SV as well to investigate for himself truth of the foundation of Taj before drifting in his feelings for Muslim-brotherhood.

    I also hope educated Pakistanis can see Quran for what it exactly is; an outgrowth of a sick mind that plagiarized the existing religious texts of Jews/Christians for creating a framework within which to fill his personal ambition of dominion over the people surrounding him and the world in general. I wish you guys luck in finding the truth before it is too late. Cheers

  68. Harry

    Joe, the problem is in order to develop, we need to face the facts in whole, not selectively.

    As I have said before the reconcilliation will come only, when Muslims admit that they have, over last one thousnad years, done tremendous damge to Hinduism and Buddhism.

    Secularist Hindus have always swindled both Hindus and Muslims to gain power, and will continue to do so in future. Developement of Hindu right is the result of perfidy by Secularist Hindus along with Muslims to Hindu community, in the same way as perfidy by Nehru caused Pakistan movement.

    Muslim community alone has the power to rectify the situation. They can do it by volenteering to build Rama Temple in Ayodhya and Buddha Statue in Bamiyan. This will reasssure Hindus and Buddhists that Islam does not pose threat to them and Muslims are not their enemies. To do that they will have to bypass both Muslim fundamentalists and Hindu secularists.

    Once that happens, Hindu right and secularists and Muslim fundamentalists will become irrelavant. Only then South Asian Hindu and Muslim community will have a chance to rebuild their countries in peace and harmony.

    Otherwise South Asia will have Armageddon.

  69. SV

    vollmond, im not sure if you were complementing me there or not?

    As an atheist and rational thinker, I am immediately roused by conspiracy theories (like the ones I mentioned) and other ‘facts’ (like Mohammed was mentioned in the Vedas). In fact, it is no less ridiculous than other claims of evolution being a ‘myth’, or how the big bang, quantum physics and every other major feat of science for the next 1000 years will somehow have been already mentioned in the Quran.

    I share your views on the Quran. It is simply not relevant anymore. However, it really annoys me to see people like ‘A True Indian’ trying to use NASA evidence to claim that we have a bridge built by engineer monkeys.

    And also, Milind Kher probably doesn’t exist – something of a Keyser Soze figure. I do.

  70. Milind Kher

    The broadmindedness of PTH is brought out by the fact that they are allowing even radically anti Islamic comments to be published because they want people to be able to express themselves.

    Would any Muslim be allowed the same liberty on a Sangh Parivar website? Ask yourself.

  71. SV

    MK,

    While I almost fully agree with you on PTH’s comment policy, I think you are giving them too much credit. Most radically anti-islamic comments seem to get through, but often I find my own comments being deleted/edited for being ‘intemperate and abusive’…

  72. Harry

    MK,

    Pakistan does not have minority problem, it is ethnically cleansed. so PTH can allow some anti-Islamic comments in their website.

    l like the proverb: ” If you scratch a secularist Hindu hard enough, you will scratch a Muslim.”

    There is difference between secularist Hindu and atheist or agnostic Hindu. Former has a political agenda of undermining Hindu empowerment.

  73. Milind Kher

    SV,

    Even if your views are diammetrically opposite to that of a particular religion, it is OK. You have the right to believe what you want to believe.

    However, if you attack others for their beliefs, that is wrong.

    If I am a monotheist, and I come across people who are polytheists, I regard it as inconsequential to my relationship with them. My belief is mine and theirs is theirs. The most important thing is to live and let live 🙂

  74. Pingback: War of words between India and Pakistan | Faridabad Metro

  75. bonobashi

    @Harry

    I am not sure I have understood your very subtle distinction.

    Could you explain in a little more detail how you distinguish between secular Hindu and atheist or agnostic Hindu? I am speaking as an agnostic Hindu, by birth a Shakta, and a confirmed secular citizen of India.

    Another thing. You said about secularist (sic) Hindus: “Former has a political agenda of undermining Hindu empowerment.” Do all secular Hindus have to be political, in your opinion? Can’t we just happen to believe that religion is an intensely personal matter, and should not be injected into the body politic?

    Rather like sexual orientation. You won’t find anybody asking you if you are heterosexual or homosexual because it’s very personal, and also because it isn’t related to your political views, and makes no difference except to your partner.

    What makes you believe that religion should be different? I am genuinely curious, and you should not react to colourful similes used, just to the questions posed, please.

  76. Harry

    Bonobashi

    Atheist by definition does not believe in God. Within Atheist category also there are wide variations of views. What an atheist strongly believes is there is no God or Gods. He does not reject laws of nature such as law of gravitation etc. If he is highly intelligent and open minded, he may even accept concept of Karma, Reincarnation and Nirvana as spiritual equivalent to law of conservation of mass and Einstein concept that matter can be destroyed to create energy, by accepting equivalence of matter and soul.

    Agnostic by definition is a person who claims he does not know enough to accept or reject God. Therefore everybody is agnostic at birth.

    Religion or belief is personal matter and is part of personal development. There is no such thing as right path or wrong path. If one decides to from point A to point B, no matter what path one may take he or she will eventually reach there as earth is round, the only argument is whether it is shortest path or not. The choice is his or her not somebody else’s.

    In Islam also there are wide variation of views and are tolerated as long as the person does not come out openly as apostate, except under Taliban.. I have met Muslims, who are vegeterians by choice, not by economic necessity.

  77. Harry

    Bonobashi

    The Charvakists are Hindu atheists.

    Secularism as practiced in India is not secularism at all. It is simply attempt by establishment to use Muslims against attempt by Dalits, tribals and other disadvantaged groups in Hindu society to better themselves. Good example is that of Mayawati, who was dragged to Jail on orders of the staunchest secularist, Mulayam Singh.

    Bulk of VHP, Bajarang Dal are dalits and tribals. For all Islam’s claim of equality Pakistani Newspaper did mentioned that Modi is not from upper caste like Digvijay Singh.

    Pakistani establishment loves South Asian system, which allows few to amass mass wealth, while others end up being destitute. They tried to misuse Islam for political purpose, and are now facing local Talibans.

    What is happening in South Asia is a class conflict, under religious cover.

    Basically there is nothing wrong with Hinduism or Islam, just they have to update according to raised human awareness worldwide.

    what is wrong is South Asian culture, which is highly exploitative.

  78. vollmond

    SV: “vollmond, im not sure if you were complementing me there or not? As an atheist and rational thinker …”

    Sorry SV, I wasn’t complementing. In fact, in today’s date “atheism/rationally thinking” itself is a kind of belief-system that engages itself in dismissal [by hook or by crook] of issues with any supernatural connotations. The very fact that atheists claim to have a ready answer to every mystery of the Universe makes it a laughable discipline; mostly though its sole objective is to ridicule religions. If there were no notion of an “all mighty” then atheism wouldn’t have existed at all today, with the so-called atheists becoming out-of-business. In other words, though ironic, atheists are there because there is God!

    I do not think that ‘A True India’ was wrong in any way to speak of the relevance of Adam’s Bridge [or, the Ram Setu] in terms of the Hindu epic Ramayana; how can one be so certain that there was no role of ancient humans [/incarnations] in altering or modulating the Earth’s landscape when one clearly knows that humans have been on this planet for couple of hundred thousand years?

    ——————–

    Milind Kher: “The broadmindedness of PTH is brought out by the fact that they are allowing even radically anti Islamic comments to be published because they want people to be able to express themselves. Would any Muslim be allowed the same liberty on a Sangh Parivar website? Ask yourself.”

    If you think my comments were “radically anti Islamic” then it becomes obvious that you know nothing of Islam. Maybe my comments were politically incorrect but factually they are all correct. And I also doubt that you have visited any websites relating to “Sangh Parivar”, because I have read most gutter-like language and abusive mindless threatful commentaries coming from [presumably] Muslims on several sites.

    ——————–

    Harry: “l like the proverb: ” If you scratch a secularist Hindu hard enough, you will scratch a Muslim.”
    There is difference between secularist Hindu and atheist or agnostic Hindu. Former has a political agenda of undermining Hindu empowerment.”

    That proverb is not too far from truth, Harry. But I do not really know what these “secularist Hindus” are, and if such a thing really exists anywhere else than in India. Indeed in Indian context it has something certainly to do with politics. Because I have never heard of secular Christians or secular Jews, the reason for which simply is that the respective counterparts of “secular Hindus” in the West are atheists. Atheists of the West are rabidly pro-Islamic and at the same time anti-religion [which of course means all other religions than Islam, and indeed as I stated above Islam is not a religion per se]. These atheists hence will project themselves as anti-Israel [Jews], anti-Bush [Christians], and presumably by extrapolation anti-RSS [Hindus]. The term “secular Hindus” hence poses some amount of ambiguity. Also I do not know if one should be caging Nehru for the creation of Pakistan, though I would certainly take his history notes with a grain of salt. Nonetheless, I see symbolic indicators in Congress as well that prove that it is somewhat nationalistic. There is a sense of nationalism in late Rajiv Gandhi’s slogan, “Mera Bharat Mahan”; also I give him full credit for taking the initiative of getting the Ram Janambhumi site unlocked in 1986. But indeed, “secularism” in Indian context is mostly a political manufacture, though not always having Congress’ monopoly. From time to time, BJP becomes secular as well!

  79. indiawala

    people, start talking about the real issues …
    what varun says is important for people who take
    varun seriously. wht abt economic and social development of our nations.
    use ur energy fr nation building

  80. gujju gangsta

    These are the various comments published and my reply to them.
    Hatred for Islam/Muslims has entered the sub-consciousness of an average Hindu. He is not willing to listen to the other side of the story. He is not willing to put himself in the other man’s shoes. 80 years of concerted campaign by RSS (aided and abetted by the Congress esp. under Mrs. Indira Gandhi) are now bearing fruit.
    Reply: After what you did to my country and community in 1947, whaddya expect?
    The whole of India is dipped in Hatred for Islam and Muslims., and the immediate whipping boy is Pakistan.
    The unfortunate part is., that this HATRED for the other will ultimately destroy eclectic Hinduism – as a philosophy and as an ideology… but they dont care.
    Reply: Why do you care about hindu spiritualism? Hindutva is semitising Hinduism, make it a mirror image of islam – any problems?

    As for the numbers about minorities please don’t pick them out of a hat. Pakistan after partition was a predominantly muslim nation and it’s natural for the minority’s percentage to decrease accordingly with time.
    Reply: EXACTLY what i want to do to the minorities in India, a predominantly hindu nation.

    The rise of intolerance and fanaticism in India is alarming. What is much more alarming though, is that it is being so widely tolerated and even supported, in the spirit of and in view of the precedent set by America’s War on Terror.
    Reply: Why be alarmed? As you sow, so you reap.

    Using Muslim blood and tears as water to knead the Hindu Cement. i.e.
    Reply: EXACTLY how pakistan was built on the blood the tears of 28% hindu-sikh population.

    The most glaring example of your secularism and democracy are Indian Muslims; those who ruled India for 600 years are now demanding jobs quota to be at par with Dalits, if not sure consult Sachar Commission report.
    Reply: RULED for 600 years, so? wanna rule for eternity? To think that these scum of society who dont have talent, cant compete, were ruling over us? the most talented community in the world.

    We, the majority of the Pakistani nation would like to see friendly, neighourly, cordial relations with India. But friendly relations not on the cost of Kashmir, not on the cost of inequality between the two countries and not on the cost of bypassing the two nation theory. People in India need to understand that Pakistan is now a reality and we are here to stay
    Reply: Not at the cost of Kashmir? So you justify the genocide of 3.5 lakh kashmiri hindus? Not at the cost of 2 nation theory. Absolutely, take kashmir, (unfinished agenda of partition) I will take the agenda of partition all the way down to kanyakumari.

    Hate is a best-seller in India., and Islam/Muslims are the easiest (soft) target…
    Reply: The SOFTEST target are your dear friends, Jews, who are just 50,000 in India, why dont we hate them? THINK………